Meteoric Patrem-Made In England...

A. G. Maisey · 9th April 2008, 01:44 PM

A piercing saw (small jewellers saw) is too difficult to control to cut the greneng. The biggest difficulty with the greneng is making sure the shape is exactly the same on both sides of the gonjo. With a file you can cut as near as you can the same, then just deepen the more shallow side a little to make it the same as the other one. You cannot do this with a piercing saw. You do not use a hacksaw to cut the greneng, you draw your shape with a scriber---draw it less than the size you want it to finish--- then you cut it from start to finish with jewellers files.There will be a rough edge on the outside of the cut when you finish, you must be very careful not to alter the shape of the greneng when you smooth away this roughness. You can polish the inside of the cuts with wet and dry paper wrapped around a sate stick. The main thing is to work very carefully and think before you cut---make sure you have a very clear picture in your mind of what you want to produce. This is the hardest thing in the whole process:- getting the clear mental picture of the form that will carry the feeling you are trying to generate.

ferrylaki · 10th April 2008, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

A piercing saw (small jewellers saw) is too difficult to control to cut the greneng. The biggest difficulty with the greneng is making sure the shape is exactly the same on both sides of the gonjo. With a file you can cut as near as you can the same, then just deepen the more shallow side a little to make it the same as the other one. You cannot do this with a piercing saw. You do not use a hacksaw to cut the greneng, you draw your shape with a scriber---draw it less than the size you want it to finish--- then you cut it from start to finish with jewellers files.There will be a rough edge on the outside of the cut when you finish, you must be very careful not to alter the shape of the greneng when you smooth away this roughness. You can polish the inside of the cuts with wet and dry paper wrapped around a sate stick. The main thing is to work very carefully and think before you cut---make sure you have a very clear picture in your mind of what you want to produce. This is the hardest thing in the whole process:- getting the clear mental picture of the form that will carry the feeling you are trying to generate.

This keris is the first project which start to take its shape.
the picture took this morning ( 05.40am jakarta time) .
the greneng work done using small jewellers saw, done by a very skilled man for sure. when I find the fact using small jewellers saw is too diffficult to do, I start looking for another method for the greneng work. I really greatfull for Alan's suggestion. I'll try it on my next keris project. I'm still looking a suitable dhapur and ricikan style for this "saton" . A straight keris it gonna be , for a beginner like my self tilam upih would be great. I'm planning to make a PBX style...thick blade, odo-odo, etc.
Just cant wait till next week to start.

FERRYLAKI
JAKARTA

A. G. Maisey · 10th April 2008, 05:40 AM

How about tilam sari? You can give it a little bit of pizzazz without trying for more than you are capable of.

The absolute first brick you need to lay is the blade angle. Get that right and the rest will follow.

ferrylaki · 10th April 2008, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

How about tilam sari? You can give it a little bit of pizzazz without trying for more than you are capable of.

The absolute first brick you need to lay is the blade angle. Get that right and the rest will follow.

Hi Alan,
the angel your talking about, the condong leleh.
I have a feeling that my saton has too much angel. this is a kelengan keris.
tilam sari would be great. thanks

FERRYLAKI
JAKARTA

A. G. Maisey · 10th April 2008, 07:10 AM

Yep, condong lelehnya too bent forward, like a sick old man.

You can fix this when you set the blade angle---probably.

You just cut the angle at the blade base to give you the proper angle for the blade, but you will still need to go back to the fire to set the pesi right. Just make sure you don't deprive yourself of enough material to give it a good wadidang. Actually, this saton looks like its had a bit too much attention in the forge, that pesi does not look as if it is big enough to give a good solid pesi.At this point the pesi should be square and much oversize.But it doesn't matter all that much, you can always work to the pesi and make sure you don't lose anything.

ferrylaki · 11th April 2008, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Yep, condong lelehnya too bent forward, like a sick old man.

You can fix this when you set the blade angle---probably.

You just cut the angle at the blade base to give you the proper angle for the blade, but you will still need to go back to the fire to set the pesi right. Just make sure you don't deprive yourself of enough material to give it a good wadidang. Actually, this saton looks like its had a bit too much attention in the forge, that pesi does not look as if it is big enough to give a good solid pesi.At this point the pesi should be square and much oversize.But it doesn't matter all that much, you can always work to the pesi and make sure you don't lose anything.

The problem at the moment is I cant find any besalen to adjust the angel.
so the next project must be changed to this keris. This keris has already took its shape. Most of the shaping worked by my brother, and a grinder was involved. We're now trying not to use grinder no more. files and hecksaw is an option.
I'll post another pictures for further progress on this keris.

hope we can make a healthy shape for this one. this is a kelengan ( pamor less keris )
the gonjo may be too small ... but it already took shape.I cant go back with the gonjo, so its done. filing and sharpening would be our next time consuming job.

FERRYLAKI
JAkarta

A. G. Maisey · 11th April 2008, 05:46 AM

Ferry, this blade needs to be refined by using scrapers. There is no more work for a hacksaw here, and the rough shaping has already been done, so there is limited work for a file. What you need now is to use scrapers to do the kruwingan and refine all the contours.

There are plenty of smiths in and around Solo. Just take the forging back there and alter the angle.Make sure you have your blak with you.

9th April 2008, 01:44 PM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	A piercing saw (small jewellers saw) is too difficult to control to cut the greneng. The biggest difficulty with the greneng is making sure the shape is exactly the same on both sides of the gonjo. With a file you can cut as near as you can the same, then just deepen the more shallow side a little to make it the same as the other one. You cannot do this with a piercing saw. You do not use a hacksaw to cut the greneng, you draw your shape with a scriber---draw it less than the size you want it to finish--- then you cut it from start to finish with jewellers files.There will be a rough edge on the outside of the cut when you finish, you must be very careful not to alter the shape of the greneng when you smooth away this roughness. You can polish the inside of the cuts with wet and dry paper wrapped around a sate stick. The main thing is to work very carefully and think before you cut---make sure you have a very clear picture in your mind of what you want to produce. This is the hardest thing in the whole process:- getting the clear mental picture of the form that will carry the feeling you are trying to generate.

10th April 2008, 05:40 AM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	How about tilam sari? You can give it a little bit of pizzazz without trying for more than you are capable of. The absolute first brick you need to lay is the blade angle. Get that right and the rest will follow.

10th April 2008, 07:10 AM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Yep, condong lelehnya too bent forward, like a sick old man. You can fix this when you set the blade angle---probably. You just cut the angle at the blade base to give you the proper angle for the blade, but you will still need to go back to the fire to set the pesi right. Just make sure you don't deprive yourself of enough material to give it a good wadidang. Actually, this saton looks like its had a bit too much attention in the forge, that pesi does not look as if it is big enough to give a good solid pesi.At this point the pesi should be square and much oversize.But it doesn't matter all that much, you can always work to the pesi and make sure you don't lose anything.

11th April 2008, 05:46 AM	#7
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Ferry, this blade needs to be refined by using scrapers. There is no more work for a hacksaw here, and the rough shaping has already been done, so there is limited work for a file. What you need now is to use scrapers to do the kruwingan and refine all the contours. There are plenty of smiths in and around Solo. Just take the forging back there and alter the angle.Make sure you have your blak with you.