Satanic dagger, Age & country of Origin?

[Bill M]

Originally Posted by wolviex

Thanks David.
Yes you maybe right and I won't dig deeper. My thought on images was just general. There are some images maybe not 'evil' but more fearsome like gargoyle/devil with great wings, skeleton in armour - well for me scary . But it depends on culture where it was made. For Europeans black is sad, and in India happy colour.

Regards!

Hi Wolviex,

In many cultures evil looking creatures are put up by the good guys to defend them from the real evil creatures OR to placate the evil creatures so they leave the good guys alone. I think that we see much more of this than we see people actually worshipping demonic spirits.

In Bali, for instance, offerings are made to demons that contain rotten foods because they think that is what the demons would like to have. Make the demons happy and they may leave you alone and also chase away other demons.

It is all in your perspective and frame of reference. For instance if you make friends with a vicious dog in your home, he will protect you. BUT to a person outside, your vicious dog may appear to be demonic.

Where black is a India color of happiness, white is their color for death.

It is very difficult to understand another culture's symbols without a deep study fo their culture, religion and history. Even then it can be terribly misunderstood. Even Margaret Mead made some mistakes.

Often, the actual natives themsleves don't understand time honored rituals and symbols. Reading a marvelous book, "Shields of Melanasia" where questions were asked about why certain devices and synbols are still being used. The natives don't know anymore. They say they use them because "they always have."

I am really enjoying this thread. I have learned a lot and am impressed (again) by the breadth, depth of knowledge and elucidation of the members here.

[Emanuel]

Hmm the great fact I was going to shatter your argument with ain't no good Spiral. First of, what I now found is a true Gothic dagger as in Mediaeval. Secondly it's ivory not cast...third it actually supports your argument, the figures are seen upright...so much for that. anyway here's the pic for interest...all the text and captions are in German so I can't give any info about it. It shows dragons which is indeed a satanic symbol in mediaeval Christian iconography, and some sort of Cerberus too.

Will keep looking for an appropriate cast 19th c. example...

Emanuel

[spiral]

Originally Posted by Manolo

Hmm the great fact I was going to shatter your argument with ain't no good Spiral. First of, what I now found is a true Gothic dagger as in Mediaeval. Secondly it's ivory not cast...third it actually supports your argument, the figures are seen upright...so much for that. anyway here's the pic for interest...all the text and captions are in German so I can't give any info about it. It shows dragons which is indeed a satanic symbol in mediaeval Christian iconography, and some sort of Cerberus too.

Will keep looking for an appropriate cast 19th c. example...

Emanuel

An intresting piece Manolo, thankyou.

Spiral

[katana]

Originally Posted by Manolo

....all the text and captions are in German so I can't give any info about it. Emanuel

Hi Emanuel,
try copying and pasting on this translation site ...


http://world.altavista.com/tr


Regards David

[spiral]

Originally Posted by Bill Marsh

Hi Wolviex,

In many cultures evil looking creatures are put up by the good guys to defend them from the real evil creatures OR to placate the evil creatures so they leave the good guys alone. I think that we see much more of this than we see people actually worshipping demonic spirits.

In Bali, for instance, offerings are made to demons that contain rotten foods because they think that is what the demons would like to have. Make the demons happy and they may leave you alone and also chase away other demons.

It is all in your perspective and frame of reference. For instance if you make friends with a viscious dog, he will protect you. BUT to a person outside, your viscious dog may appear to be demonic.

Where black is a India color of happiness, white is their color for death.

It is very difficult to understand another culture's symbols without a deep study fo their culture, religion and history. Even then it can be terribly misunderstood.

Often, the actual natives themsleves don't understand time honored rituals and symbols. Reading a marvelous book, "Shields of Melanasia" where questions were asked about why certain devices and synbols are still being used. The natives don't know anymore. They say they use them because "they always have."

I am really enjoying this thread. I have learned a lot and am impressed (again) by the breadth, depth of knowledge and elucidation of the members here.

Good & valid points Bill.

Spiral