Takouba with european blade

Ascalon · 6th March 2009, 05:14 PM

I bought it this week
Someone could helpme about the age ?
Thanks
Emmanuel

Jim McDougall · 6th March 2009, 09:09 PM

Wow!! Emmanuel, you have a treasure there in that blade. That appears to be a genuine Solingen blade from the 17th century, possibly even a Passau blade from the earlier part. The running wolf mark is distinctively associated with Passau, but became more widely used later.

It would be hard to imagine just how early this blade entered the Tuareg sphere in the Sahara, but they were traditionally sacrosanct and handed down in family and tribal units faithfully for a very long time. Since you are in France, I must imagine that this takouba may have been an item acquired in colonial situations in North Africa, and these were often obtained by troops in occupation.
This makes this piece most desirable, as most blades seen on takoubas in collections these days are native made examples.

The scabbard and mounts on these weapons are typically relatively new as these blades are constantly refurbished as desert climate and wear take thier toll, and they are often remounted as they change hands.

All best regards,
Jim

ariel · 6th March 2009, 10:59 PM

I always thought that the wolf should face to the left. My mistake or inverted pic?

Ascalon · 7th March 2009, 02:21 PM

Thanks for comments.
I don't receive the takouba yet.
It is the seller's photo so i don't know if the pic is inverted.

Jim McDougall · 7th March 2009, 04:47 PM

According to the Passau swordblade makers manual, Section III, item 4, article 13.....the wolf mark can be facing either direction depending on if the maker or apprentice is right or left handed, and the astronomical alignments at the time of completion.

Just kidding

looking forward to seeing more when the sword arrives.

ariel · 7th March 2009, 05:00 PM

I have a Khevsur sword with mechanical damascus blade and the same mark.

Jim McDougall · 7th March 2009, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

I have a Khevsur sword with mechanical damascus blade and the same mark.

Ahah! The plot thickens!

Is the mark similar? and directionally corroborated?

ariel · 7th March 2009, 08:55 PM

Sorry, I was imprecise. Not the wolf, the circle with the cross.

Jim McDougall · 7th March 2009, 09:13 PM

No problem! I recognize the three fuller blade....is this one that is termed the 'kaldam' ? I dont have Askhabov with me, but I seem to recall that the cross was significant in referring to blades called by this term.

BTW, note the 'twig' marks near the hilt on this blade we are discussing. These are noted in numerous captions in the Wallace Collection volumes.

Norman McCormick · 7th March 2009, 11:39 PM

Hi,
There was a maker, Heinrick Kohl, who was active in Solingen,16th Cent, who marked his blades with the Orb and the Cross as well as the Passau Wolf!!!!!!!!!!
Regards,
Norman.

6th March 2009, 05:14 PM	#1
Ascalon Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: France Posts: 45	Takouba with european blade I bought it this week Someone could helpme about the age ? Thanks Emmanuel

7th March 2009, 05:00 PM	#6
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	I have a Khevsur sword with mechanical damascus blade and the same mark. Last edited by ariel; 7th March 2009 at 05:15 PM.

7th March 2009, 08:55 PM	#8
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Sorry, I was imprecise. Not the wolf, the circle with the cross. Attached Images

6th March 2009, 09:09 PM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,943	Wow!! Emmanuel, you have a treasure there in that blade. That appears to be a genuine Solingen blade from the 17th century, possibly even a Passau blade from the earlier part. The running wolf mark is distinctively associated with Passau, but became more widely used later. It would be hard to imagine just how early this blade entered the Tuareg sphere in the Sahara, but they were traditionally sacrosanct and handed down in family and tribal units faithfully for a very long time. Since you are in France, I must imagine that this takouba may have been an item acquired in colonial situations in North Africa, and these were often obtained by troops in occupation. This makes this piece most desirable, as most blades seen on takoubas in collections these days are native made examples. The scabbard and mounts on these weapons are typically relatively new as these blades are constantly refurbished as desert climate and wear take thier toll, and they are often remounted as they change hands. All best regards, Jim

6th March 2009, 10:59 PM	#3
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	I always thought that the wolf should face to the left. My mistake or inverted pic?

7th March 2009, 02:21 PM	#4
Ascalon Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: France Posts: 45	Thanks for comments. I don't receive the takouba yet. It is the seller's photo so i don't know if the pic is inverted.

7th March 2009, 04:47 PM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,943	According to the Passau swordblade makers manual, Section III, item 4, article 13.....the wolf mark can be facing either direction depending on if the maker or apprentice is right or left handed, and the astronomical alignments at the time of completion. Just kidding looking forward to seeing more when the sword arrives.

7th March 2009, 09:13 PM	#9
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,943	No problem! I recognize the three fuller blade....is this one that is termed the 'kaldam' ? I dont have Askhabov with me, but I seem to recall that the cross was significant in referring to blades called by this term. BTW, note the 'twig' marks near the hilt on this blade we are discussing. These are noted in numerous captions in the Wallace Collection volumes.

7th March 2009, 11:39 PM	#10
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,596	Hi, There was a maker, Heinrick Kohl, who was active in Solingen,16th Cent, who marked his blades with the Orb and the Cross as well as the Passau Wolf!!!!!!!!!! Regards, Norman.