Five kampilans: which two to buy?

[migueldiaz]

Following Spunjer's tip on which shop to check out in Manila for good Moro pieces, I got to see the other day the five kampilans below.

Can I please request for your usual kind comments and suggestions on which one/s should I buy? Let's say if my budget is good for just two kampilans, which two would they be in your opinion?

We are not after a consensus obviously, as it's understood that there's also subjectivity involved.

Hope you can give feedback!

Here's the first set out of four sets of photos:

[migueldiaz]

Second photo set of four:

[migueldiaz]

Third photo set of four:

[migueldiaz]

Fourth photo set of four is found below.

So which would be the top two pieces you can recommend? Remember, we are not after a consensus here ... so please feel free to give your own views.

Thanks again!

[VANDOO]

IT WOULD APPEAR THAT YOU HAVE MADE THE SELECTIONS I WOULD HAVE. ALL OF THESE MAY HAVE BEEN MADE FOR THE TOURIST MARKET BUT IN THE EARLIER PICTURES THE 2 TO THE RIGHT ARE OF BETTER WORKMANSHIP, THEY ARE ALSO THE TWO YOU PICTURED LAST. THE ONE WITH THE COIN FOR AN EYE AND THE SILVER WIRE WORK AND ATTACHED PANNELS OF SOMETHING IS THE MOST ATTRACTIVE. I CAN'T TELL FROM PICTURES IF THE BLADE OR HANDLE IS AN OLD ORIGINAL OR NOT BUT DO SUSPECT THE COIN, WIRE AND ATTACHED PANNELS ARE ADD ONS IF IT IS AN OLD ONE. THE OTHER ONE'S HANDLE LOOKS OLDER BUT IT ALSO LOOKS LIKE IT MAY BE ARTIFICIALLY AGED. BEARING IN MIND ALL THAT CHECK BALANCE BLADE THICKNESS AND IF THE WORK LOOKS OLD AND THAT SOMETHING IS NOT JUST A BIT OFF TO MAKE YOU SUSPICIOUS. THEN IF YOU LIKE THEM AND CAN GET A GOOD PRICE ON THEM GO FOR IT. EVEN IF THEY ARE OF WW2 OR LATER MANUFACTURE IN 100 YEARS THEY WILL BE GOOD OLD ONES.

[Rick]

Look for good flex in the blade; check the taper of the blade looking down the spine; it should taper evenly to almost wafer thin at the point .

I won't suggest an example for you to buy however .
I cannot hold them in my hands .

[Battara]

I'm with Vandoo, the last 2 on the right....Blades are better as well as craftsmanship.

[migueldiaz]

Thanks, Vandoo, Rick, and Battara!

Super. I appreciate it

[Rick]

Keep us posted on your progress .

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by Rick

Keep us posted on your progress .

Hi Rick

So far no decision yet. It looks like I'd have a higher comfort level if I buy from forumites instead.

So, I'll just sit here and wait

Thanks/ regards.

[Bill M]

Originally Posted by migueldiaz

Hi Rick

So far no decision yet. It looks like I'd have a higher comfort level if I buy from forumites instead.

So, I'll just sit here and wait

Thanks/ regards.

Good idea! You can do better than these in the pictures you show.

[Mytribalworld]

Hi,

Not that I hurts me or anything but aren't you discussing about 5 pieces which are for sale at a dealersshop so that actually we should avoid this kind of threads? Well anyway.... no cameras on my stand guys

[Rick]

Originally Posted by migueldiaz

Hi Rick

So far no decision yet. It looks like I'd have a higher comfort level if I buy from forumites instead.

So, I'll just sit here and wait

Thanks/ regards.

There are no problems with importation of swords to the Philippines ?

[VANDOO]

I GUESS WE ARE TIP-TOEING ALONG THE EDGE BETWEEN THE OPEN FORUM AND THE SWAP FORUM HERE. WE MAY BE SHOWING PICTURES OF SOME SHOPS THAT ARE IN COMPETICIAN WITH OTHERS BUT AS LONG AS WE DON'T MAKE AN ADVERTIZEMENT FOR THEM GIVING ADDRESS AND TELEPHONE INFO I GUESS WE ARE SAFE. MEMBERS CAN ALWAYS P.M. FOR THAT INFO IF THEY WANT AND THE POSTER CAN GIVE IT OR KEEP IT SECRET AS HE PLEASES.
THIS IS LIKE A COLLECTOR ASKING QUESTIONS OF THE OLDER MORE EXPERIENCED COLLECTORS ON SOMETHING BEFORE HE BUYS IT. I USED TO ASK A LOT OF QUESTIONS OF THE OLDER DEALERS AND COLLECTORS AT GUN SHOWS WHEN I WAS YOUNG AND GETTING STARTED AND THINK IT IS A GOOD THING. IT SAVED ME FROM MAKEING SOME MISTAKES AND GETTING BURNED AS OFTEN AS I WOULD HAVE WITHOUT ANY INFORMATION. FORTUNATELY I NEVER HAD ENOUGH CASH TO GET BURNED BADLY ANYWAY IF I ONLY HAD THE MONEY AND THE KNOWLEGE BACK THEN WHAT A COLLECTION I COULD HAVE HAD.

I ALWAYS ENJOY LOOKING AROUND SUCH SHOPS , AND AS I DON'T GET OUT MUCH ANYMORE IT IS FUN AND BRINGS BACK MEMORIES TO SEE SUCH PICTURES. SO I SEE NOTHING WRONG WITH POSTING SUCH PICTURES AS LONG AS IT DOSEN'T GET OUT OF HAND AND CLOG UP THE FORUM WORKS.
SO SELECT THE BEST PHOTOS AND DON'T SHOW THE SAME THINGS TOO MANY TIMES, IN SHORT EDIT THE POST AND ATTACHMENTS TO AVOID REPEATICION AND MAKEING THE POST TOO UNWEILDLY. GOOD THINGS WITH MODERATION AND NO ADVERTIZEING SHOULD BE THE RULE HERE. IF A FORUM MEMBER ASKS TO BE PUT IN TOUCH WITH OR FOR AN ADDRESS WITH A SHOP THIS SHOULD BE DONE BETWEEN MEMBERS OFF FORUM THRU EMAIL OR P.M.
JUST MY TWO CENTS WORTH

[Rick]

Originally Posted by mandaukudi

Hi,

Not that I hurts me or anything but aren't you discussing about 5 pieces which are for sale at a dealersshop so that actually we should avoid this kind of threads? Well anyway.... no cameras on my stand guys

As far as I know the shop owner does not post here .

We should probably let Andrew decide the fate of this thread as far as policy goes .
If you like you may use the report post feature to alert him .

Rick

I also agree with Vandoo; too many pictures do waste valuable Server space .

[migueldiaz]

Hi Vandoo,

Thanks for the comments and guidance!

I'm trying to delete some of the pics now, but the "Edit" button is gone in my case. [Perhaps the moderator then can do the deletion of some of the pics? Thanks in advance.]

Originally Posted by Rick

There are no problems with importation of swords to the Philippines ?

Hello Rick,

Yes, there is no problem nor any issue in there. Thanks for the reminder just the same ... appreciate it

Originally Posted by mandaukudi

Hi, Not that I hurts me or anything but aren't you discussing about 5 pieces which are for sale at a dealersshop so that actually we should avoid this kind of threads? Well anyway.... no cameras on my stand guys

Hi Mandaukudi,

Thank you for bringing up this important aspect. I truly appreciate it.

I'm sure that everyone agrees that the discussion here is all being done in good faith. So there is no question in that.

But I do realize that if there will be negative comments given on the pieces displayed in a particular shop, that would sort of 'hurt' the storeowner. Though on the other hand, perhaps not really as nobody actually knows where the shop is. Just thinking out loud ...

Would you have any suggestion then on how these things can better be handled?

For sure I can do the solicitation of opinion on the pieces via PM's, or emails if I have the addresses of the forumites. But that would be tedious of course.

From your perspective then, we hope you can further share your views, or better yet give suggestions on possible approaches.

Thanks!

PS - On a related matter, a dealer of Moro swords here in the Philippines earlier emailed me pics of an ivory-pommeled kris. Just to make sure that I'm in keeping with the guidelines of the forum, can I once again post the pictures for comments? I'll do that in a separate thread if it's ok.

And given the thing on CITES, is anything related to ivory a sore point at the moment and thus posts related to it should be avoided?

Just trying to make sure I will not be stepping into somebody's toes!

Thanks again everyone. You've all been very helpful. Super.

[Bill M]

Originally Posted by migueldiaz

Would you have any suggestion then on how these things can better be handled?

For sure I can do the solicitation of opinion on the pieces via PM's, or emails if I have the addresses of the forumites. But that would be tedious of course.

Miguel,

I think that we all got caught up in your enthusiasm. We know there was no intention of wrongdoing.

However...

As I understand this, the discussion begins to border on asking public questions about pieces that are for sale. It is possible that the seller could take offense.

I'd suggest, to be one the safe, though "tedious" side, that you make specific inquiries by PM as to value and quality.

I'd think that posting an ivory handle weapon for comments would not be a problem.

The question is asking "Should I buy this one or this one and why?" Might elicit comments that a seller could find offensive.

Somehow this must have arisen in the past, prompting rules of this Forum. I'd leave the fine points to our legal moderator, whom I believe is Andrew or Mark.

[hideyoshi]

First of all, this forum is sure educational to new collectors and as well to those knowledgeable collectors who want to sharpened there knowledge on what they collect, very nice.


To respond to Mr. Bill Marsh's note. I had read a posting of yours regarding a Katana you were about to buy one time, and several other ethnographic weapons, shields and others. Your postings/intensions were truly plain and simple, to verify from the knowledgeable if what your about to buy is ligit? Did all this deal went thru? what happen to the sellers? I am attaching one of your previous posting

Let's let the moderators look in to this. Thnks.


http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...light=japanese

Originally Posted by Bill Marsh

Miguel,
I think that we all got caught up in your enthusiasm. We know there was no intention of wrongdoing.

However...

As I understand this, the discussion begins to border on asking public questions about pieces that are for sale. It is possible that the seller could take offense.

I'd suggest, to be one the safe, though "tedious" side, that you make specific inquiries by PM as to value and quality.

I'd think that posting an ivory handle weapon for comments would not be a problem.

The question is asking "Should I buy this one or this one and why?" Might elicit comments that a seller could find offensive.

Somehow this must have arisen in the past, prompting rules of this Forum. I'd leave the fine points to our legal moderator, whom I believe is Andrew or Mark.

[VANDOO]

FIRST OF ALL I WILL SAY I PERSONALLY SEE NOTHING WRONG WITH THE QUESTIONS POSTED AND THE INTENT WAS HONEST AND OPEN.
SO BEFORE WE MAKE A MOUNTAIN OUT OF A MOLE HILL AND MAKE SO MANY RULES AND REGULATIONS THAT IT EITHER BECOMES TOO DIFFICULT TO REMEMBER THEM ALL SO POSTING BECOMES A JOB INSTEAD OF FUN.
NOT BEING A MODERATOR I CAN ONLY STATE MY OPINION AND SUGGESTIONS, WEATHER YOU LIKE THEM OR NOT IS UP TO YOU

I THINK PERHAPS SOME OF US LEARNED SOMETHING FROM BILLS POST AS WELL AS MIGUELS POSTS. PERHAPS THEY COULD HAVE ALL BEEN IMPROVED.
BUT OFTEN I JUMP ON AND OFF THE COMPUTER AND THINK OF SOMETHING (AS I AM DOING NOW) AND JUST TYPE IT OUT. I DO TRY TO GO OVER IT AND MAKE SURE IT DOSEN'T CONTAIN UNECESSARY STUFF THAT IS NOT FOR FUN OR INFORMATIVE UNLESSSS I GO TOO SLEEEP FIIRRSST.

SO WE ALL DO NEED TO MAKE OUR POSTS FAIRLY CONCISE AND EASILY UNDERSTANDABLE AND TRY NOT TO CLUTTER THEM UP TO MUCH. BUT WE ALSO NEED TO ALLOW QUITE A BIT OF LATITUDE FOR POSTS AND KEEP THE RULES AS EASY AND SIMPLE AS POSSIBLE TO ENCOURAGE NEW POSTERS TO GET THEIR FEET WET AND TO KEEP IT EASY AND UNCOMPLICATED FOR US OLD CODGERS.
WE WILL LEARN MORE FROM ONE BEGINNING COLLECTORS POST THAN FROM A THOUSAND LURKERS AND IT SEEMS THATS JUST ABOUT THE PERCENTAGES BETWEEN THE TWO. "TIME FOR BED" "HEY THATS JUST CLUTTER"

[Bill M]

Enough said

[Andrew]

This type of thread is fine, as it doesn't appear these items are the subject of an active auction. The rationale behind the prohibition against discussing active auctions has been set forth in detail previously, so I won't bother to go into it again here.

Discussion of ivory items here is absolutely okay. We're not eBay.

[hideyoshi]

Thank you so much Moderators for your unbiased answer towards my post.

Bill Marsh, I am not trying to engage you argumentatively, it's just very anoying sometimes seeing someone taking advantage of this forum for he's own benifits, and then, when he sees someone doing his own doing, he dis's them, it doesn't seem's fair. Either your stacking an all ivory swords in your vault or collecting a piece of rusty junk swords, as a collector, each should be treated fairly.

Originally Posted by Bill Marsh

Enough said