Any idea on this.. maybe Jambiya?

shortfoot · 8th August 2006, 02:01 AM

Hello, first post. My brother in law has acquired this dagger. We have no idea how old the dagger is, or the worth of such an item. It has what looks to be a horn handle, as I can see no grains of wood. the sheath is definately wooden inside, with what looks like leather on the outside, all the silver looking metal is thin and all of the silver ropes are single strands wrapping around the sheath. Any information you folks could provide would be a great help. Thanks

RhysMichael · 8th August 2006, 02:20 AM

I would guess an omani jambiya but I could be wrong. As you say the handle is probably horn. It looks nice but I know little about these but it looks nice.
Do you have any better pictures of the blade ?

shortfoot · 8th August 2006, 02:34 AM

Sure, here are some.

Lew · 8th August 2006, 02:44 AM

Welcome Short foot!

That is a nice Omani Jambiya Mid 20th century I would guess.

Lew

shortfoot · 8th August 2006, 05:36 AM

Is there any way we can go about finding if it's real silver it is decorated with? It's approximate worth? And is there any way to accurately tell it's age? (within reason) My brother in law got this from his mother, and she doesn't even remember where she got it. So it's a mystery to us. Thanks!

S.Al-Anizi · 8th August 2006, 06:03 AM

This is an Omani Jambiya, with a probably rhino horn hilt, and silver fittings. As Louie said, this is quite recent work, but its definetly not a tourist piece, this one is quite high grade than others recently made that Ive seen. As to the blade, it could either be a forged steel blade, hopefully, or a two piece sheet steel welded together. Try patting on the blade or striking it carefully on the wall and see what kind of sound you get.

S.Al-Anizi · 8th August 2006, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shortfoot

Is there any way we can go about finding if it's real silver it is decorated with? It's approximate worth? And is there any way to accurately tell it's age? (within reason) My brother in law got this from his mother, and she doesn't even remember where she got it. So it's a mystery to us. Thanks!

These ones are fitted with real silver, not just a crust. As to age, its quite hard, arab jambiyas didnt change much in style, and ones from late 19th centuries are the same styles made today still.

Henk · 8th August 2006, 10:37 AM

Shortfoot,

Welcome to the forum.

Looks like a nice jambiya to me. The hilt could be rhinohorn but a very good picture of the hilt can give the answer by the experts.

You asked twice for the worth of the jambiya. Maybe you didn't read the forum rules but we don't talk about the worth of an object. We discuss the item, not the money.

Yannis · 8th August 2006, 03:48 PM

Wellcome to the forum Sortfoot

I am almost sure the hilt is rhino horn. To find out put in front of a strong light. If it is transluent it rhino. This puts your jambiya over the average.

Lew · 8th August 2006, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yannis

Wellcome to the forum Sortfoot

I am almost sure the hilt is rhino horn. To find out put in front of a strong light. If it is transluent it rhino. This puts your jambiya over the average.

Gentleman

Not all translucent horn is rhino horn I have seen some pretty dark pieces that are not that translucent and have seen other types of horn that are not rhino that are. You really must look for those fiber stuctures in the horn. On some old chooras I have seen them use a cross cut section of the horn where the fibers can be seen as tiny dots on the surface of the hilt slabs.
Here is one that Artzi had a while back this is a good example of what I was trying to explain.

Lew

spiral · 9th August 2006, 01:55 AM

In the last year Ive researched rhino horn extensivly to help my studies & Ive seen many pieces & spoken to & studied the works of true experts of horn cups , bowls etc.& examined numerous samples of many horn types both by buying for study raw horns & studying other peoples collections as well as my own..

Lots of animals can sometimes provide heavily fiberous &/or translucent horn including, cow, goat ,buffalo & various antelopes.

I see them sold as rhino all the time by many antique arms dealers.

The point Louie makes is the definative one regarding the "dots", Rhino horn end grain has a texture that resembles orange peel.

Evrything else that hasnt that feature isnt rhino horn.

Spiral

The Double D · 9th August 2006, 05:50 AM

Since the issue of monetary value can't be discussed on this forum, how is worth established. Not monetary value, although monetary value is a factor in collecting. If i can't afford it I can't collect it.

Is this piece worthy of collecting. Is it a good representational piece from a specific culture or location.? Is this a piece you put in your collection until you find a better piece. Is this a good starter piece? Or, is this piece something you could call good enough and move on to other items?

Andrew · 9th August 2006, 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Double D

Since the issue of monetary value can't be discussed on this forum, how is worth established. Not monetary value, although monetary value is a factor in collecting. If i can't afford it I can't collect it.

Is this piece worthy of collecting. Is it a good representational piece from a specific culture or location.? Is this a piece you put in your collection until you find a better piece. Is this a good starter piece? Or, is this piece something you could call good enough and move on to other items?

Excellent points, DD. "Worth" can be measured in many ways other than the assignment of a monetary value. In addition to the qualities you mention, opinions on quality, rarity, condition and desireability are all helpful indicators of value or worth.

I know very little about jambiya, so I can't comment about this specific item.

Yannis · 9th August 2006, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOUIEBLADES

Gentleman

Not all translucent horn is rhino horn I have seen some pretty dark pieces that are not that translucent and have seen other types of horn that are not rhino that are.

Lew
I had wrote the same thing few days ago.
Look here.
But in this particular jambiya the hilt will be transluent under strong light.

shortfoot · 17th August 2006, 02:53 AM

Thank you all for your great and wise replies. And no, I didn't know that it was iksnay to talk about monetary worth. My apologies. That would be a good question, whether it's just a run of the mill generic Jambiya or something that's really a find. Though from what y'all say it sounds like these are a dime a dozen (no monetary pun intended

) in the arab areas. Thank you

Rick · 17th August 2006, 04:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOUIEBLADES

Gentleman

Not all translucent horn is rhino horn I have seen some pretty dark pieces that are not that translucent and have seen other types of horn that are not rhino that are. You really must look for those fiber stuctures in the horn. On some old chooras I have seen them use a cross cut section of the horn where the fibers can be seen as tiny dots on the surface of the hilt slabs.
Here is one that Artzi had a while back this is a good example of what I was trying to explain.

Lew

Lew,
What are you doing with my karud !? LOL
I am amazed at the conformity of style of the Bukharan karuds .

Montino Bourbon · 17th August 2006, 04:59 AM

Funny... I thought it was mine!

Almost finished making a sheath for mine.

derek · 17th August 2006, 05:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shortfoot

Thank you all for your great and wise replies. And no, I didn't know that it was iksnay to talk about monetary worth. My apologies. That would be a good question, whether it's just a run of the mill generic Jambiya or something that's really a find. Though from what y'all say it sounds like these are a dime a dozen (no monetary pun intended

) in the arab areas. Thank you

Hi Shortfoot,

That's a nice jambiya, definitely not considered dime a dozen where it comes from. In fact, quite the opposite. That blade looks like it could be the original, and even though some collectors would make the case that these blades are inferior to some of the other workmanship you find in the near & far east, this jambiya would have been a symbol of rank and worth to any local that saw it. They prize those old blades more than the silver work in the Arabian peninsula. Locals used to tell me to place the point (gently!) in my palm and see if I could feel a tingle. If so, it's a "special" blade. That's good silver work too, by the way. Most jambiyas with old silver work still have a shiny new (cheap quality) chromed blade, so yours is better than many that make it out of the region.
Regards,
-d

8th August 2006, 02:01 AM	#1
shortfoot Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 4	Any idea on this.. maybe Jambiya? Hello, first post. My brother in law has acquired this dagger. We have no idea how old the dagger is, or the worth of such an item. It has what looks to be a horn handle, as I can see no grains of wood. the sheath is definately wooden inside, with what looks like leather on the outside, all the silver looking metal is thin and all of the silver ropes are single strands wrapping around the sheath. Any information you folks could provide would be a great help. Thanks Attached Images

8th August 2006, 02:34 AM	#3
shortfoot Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 4	Sure, here are some. Attached Images

17th August 2006, 04:59 AM	#17
Montino Bourbon Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Santa Barbara, California Posts: 301	Is that your karud? Funny... I thought it was mine! Almost finished making a sheath for mine.

8th August 2006, 02:20 AM	#2
RhysMichael Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Virginia Posts: 520	I would guess an omani jambiya but I could be wrong. As you say the handle is probably horn. It looks nice but I know little about these but it looks nice. Do you have any better pictures of the blade ?

8th August 2006, 02:44 AM	#4
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Welcome Short foot! That is a nice Omani Jambiya Mid 20th century I would guess. Lew

8th August 2006, 05:36 AM	#5
shortfoot Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 4	Is there any way we can go about finding if it's real silver it is decorated with? It's approximate worth? And is there any way to accurately tell it's age? (within reason) My brother in law got this from his mother, and she doesn't even remember where she got it. So it's a mystery to us. Thanks!

8th August 2006, 06:03 AM	#6
S.Al-Anizi Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Arabia Posts: 278	This is an Omani Jambiya, with a probably rhino horn hilt, and silver fittings. As Louie said, this is quite recent work, but its definetly not a tourist piece, this one is quite high grade than others recently made that Ive seen. As to the blade, it could either be a forged steel blade, hopefully, or a two piece sheet steel welded together. Try patting on the blade or striking it carefully on the wall and see what kind of sound you get.

8th August 2006, 10:37 AM	#8
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	Shortfoot, Welcome to the forum. Looks like a nice jambiya to me. The hilt could be rhinohorn but a very good picture of the hilt can give the answer by the experts. You asked twice for the worth of the jambiya. Maybe you didn't read the forum rules but we don't talk about the worth of an object. We discuss the item, not the money.

8th August 2006, 03:48 PM	#9
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	Wellcome to the forum Sortfoot I am almost sure the hilt is rhino horn. To find out put in front of a strong light. If it is transluent it rhino. This puts your jambiya over the average.

9th August 2006, 01:55 AM	#11
spiral Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,712	In the last year Ive researched rhino horn extensivly to help my studies & Ive seen many pieces & spoken to & studied the works of true experts of horn cups , bowls etc.& examined numerous samples of many horn types both by buying for study raw horns & studying other peoples collections as well as my own.. Lots of animals can sometimes provide heavily fiberous &/or translucent horn including, cow, goat ,buffalo & various antelopes. I see them sold as rhino all the time by many antique arms dealers. The point Louie makes is the definative one regarding the "dots", Rhino horn end grain has a texture that resembles orange peel. Evrything else that hasnt that feature isnt rhino horn. Spiral

9th August 2006, 05:50 AM	#12
The Double D Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: On the banks of Cut Bank Creek, Montana Posts: 189	Since the issue of monetary value can't be discussed on this forum, how is worth established. Not monetary value, although monetary value is a factor in collecting. If i can't afford it I can't collect it. Is this piece worthy of collecting. Is it a good representational piece from a specific culture or location.? Is this a piece you put in your collection until you find a better piece. Is this a good starter piece? Or, is this piece something you could call good enough and move on to other items?

17th August 2006, 02:53 AM	#15
shortfoot Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 4	Thank you all for your great and wise replies. And no, I didn't know that it was iksnay to talk about monetary worth. My apologies. That would be a good question, whether it's just a run of the mill generic Jambiya or something that's really a find. Though from what y'all say it sounds like these are a dime a dozen (no monetary pun intended ) in the arab areas. Thank you