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#1 |
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The seller doesn't know ... and neither do i
![]() It is in wood and about 5" long. Any guess, Gentlemen? Fernando . |
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#2 | |
Keris forum moderator
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#3 | |
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#4 |
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Hi Fernando,
You are the master of esoteric acquisitions! Without context or any note of provenance, it would of course be really hard to say exactly what this might be, but the crosses would suggest the obvious Christian associations, and this would possibly be a votive of some kind. Such items were often created in symbolic images, but at this point it would be tough to guess. All the best, Jim |
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#5 | |
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![]() Why didn't i think of that, in the first place? ... used by the priest to throw the communion wafers into the congregants mouths; good to avoid H1N1 contamination ![]() Fernando |
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#6 |
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Hi Jim,
Thanks for the hint ![]() No, no context or provenance, except that this is a Christian influenced region and, as you well suggest, the crosses are a symbolic reminder. Only i think they are just alegoric and the object might as well be some kind of utensil, not necessarily with a direct connection to religious paraphernalia. Fernando |
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#7 | |
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Hi Rick,
Quote:
![]() Is this the meaning? ![]() Fernando |
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#8 |
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Hi Fernando,
You are correct Sir . ![]() I needed to laugh a bit last night; my apologies . ![]() Do we have an origin for this piece ? |
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#9 | ||
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![]() Fernando |
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#11 |
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I saw this on Fagan's militaria site... he describes it as a Sudanese War club (?)
![]() alternatively, it could just as easily be an ancient egyptian can opener. Last edited by Bryan.H; 4th August 2009 at 07:07 PM. |
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#12 |
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It does have a bit of an African look, so with the Christian imagery, this would point to Highland Ethiopia. Ethiopian priests did carry hand crosses in procession usually made of metal...
Just a guess |
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#13 |
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Let's avoid making silly comments about religious practises, such as Holy Communion, which I for one take quite seriously. Having said that, I believe this is an Ethiopian SISTRUM. It is missing the top part with the metal disks.
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#14 |
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Hi Roanoa,
Do you have an example sistrum that looks like this? Most of the "ethiopian" sistrums shown on Google have much thinner uprights, and I'd expect to see holes drilled through it to hold the disks if it was a sistrum. Neat object. I didn't know what a lucet was until Jeff brought it up. Best, F |
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#15 |
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I looked up Google Images for "lucet" and there is indeed a strong similarity, though there is no hole beneath the "fork". The reason why I suggested a sistrum is because of the religious symbols. A simple string could be tied to the fork and there really is no need for holes to be drilled. Again, on Google Images I found a "How to make a sistrum" with a wooden fork and a string (plus the metal disks). So I still believe it is a possibility, though, of corse, I cannot be sure....
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#16 |
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not all the lucets i saw in the internet had holes. i'm tending towards that option. even monks or nuns would have done something like lucetting to occupy their time and make useful cords.
of course, it is also likely to be a plumber's tool. |
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#17 | |
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![]() I am also dubious about whether it is a weapon of any kind. |
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#18 | |
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#19 |
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Looks like a pious persons knitting or lace making tool? I think it is most probably European. If it was from Yorkshire it would be worth an awful lot of money.
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#20 | ||
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BTW, did you know that the sistrum, provenant from the egiptian cult to Isis, was forbidden in the VI century Concilium? So true that it maintained its existence with Copta Christianism until present days. Fernando Last edited by fernando; 6th August 2009 at 12:36 PM. Reason: word addition- phrase correction |
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#21 |
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Thank you all for your sugestions, Gentlemen.
This exercize of trying to find out what an unkown thing is, can be a fascinating theme, specially because of the variety of sugestions put up. So far we have a lucet, a slingshot ( ![]() ![]() Although the lucet seems to be the closest sugestion, i don't think it is one; but i am not based in any evidence to so think. I could swear it is not from Yorkshire ![]() ![]() Fernando. |
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#22 |
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Could it be a distaff?
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#23 | |
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#24 |
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the 'plumbers tool' was a reference to the other thread about a lead headed cane whose explanation varied from trench club to rabbit throwing stick and turned out to be a plumbing tool used to bang out dents in lead pipes.
in other words, keep your options open, it could be anything. probably something not mentioned that was in common use way back but is not now. 5 inches is a bit short for a war club i suspect. |
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#25 | |
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![]() Yes Jim, also a sugestion to consider; i must honestly confess, though, that i still don't see light in the end of the tunnel ![]() Thank's a lot all the same. Fernando |
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#26 | |
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But with those conical prongs, wouldn't the yarn slip away? Fernando |
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#27 |
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My Wife who spins, knits, and is a high end Seamstress says it is too small to be a distaff .
On my computer screen 'Nando's full shot of this device renders larger than it actually is . ![]() |
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#28 |
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The more I look at this, the more I become interested in the details.
For instance, the area between the two uprights appears to be carved down to an edge, and the supports for the uprights have those grooves which appear to be lined up. There are a couple of possibilities. Either it's a tool, in which case the details are functionally significant, or it's some sort of symbolic item. In the later case, it's pretty clearly Christian, but I keep seeing some sort of "devil's horn" gesture in the uprights, combined with the three crosses, that makes me skeptical. I don't have an answer, but despite what Rick's wife says, I keep coming back to something associated with thread or yarn-making. Something associated with a spinning wheel? Given the wood construction and lack of wear, if it was a tool, it pretty definitely had to be used for manipulating soft materials like thread, yarn, cord, or cloth. Best, F |
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#29 |
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At 5" tall, there aren't many things it can be. Small, must be portable. Decorated, personalized to the owner's taste. Something that would be used more or less commonly. The two horns look worn down, the surface is smooth from handling. Must have been held in the hand, subject to a fair bit of rubbing. I could see it used in weaving of some sort. A type of weaving comb?
Lucet seems most likely, not all have holes - see pic below. Thoughts... Emanuel |
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#30 |
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Hi Emanuel,
Interesting problem with the lucet theory: the edges of the piece. None of the lucet images I've seen have smooth, rounded edges, not bevels and grooves. As others noted, they also tend to have swelled ends and narrow arm bases, presumably to keep the yarns on the lucet. While I don't have a better candidate, I'm not convinced yet. Best, F |
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