Sword from Sumatara with early European Blade

Oriental-Arms · 29th April 2009, 09:00 PM

I was hesitating if to post this thread in the Ethnographic forum but as the blade here is the most interesting part I finally voted for the European armory forum:

This sword, also known as Piso Podang is coming from Sumatra, Indonesia and usually associated with the Batak people. I have seen many similar swords employing any available blade, but this one is very interesting, as its blade I believe is early European, 17 C. or even earlier:

Blade length 31 inches. Central nice long fuller 28 inches long:

There is a what might be a maker mark just below the Langet:

I will appreciate any suggestions on the blade age and/or origin

Norman McCormick · 29th April 2009, 11:50 PM

Hi,
The appearance of this blade would probably place it, according to the usual typology, as an Xa or thereabouts. This type was most commonly used from the 11th through to the end of the 13th Cent. Although not impossible it is highly improbable that the blade would be in this age range therefore I think that the key to determining age/origin would be through the engraving. With this in mind I wouldn't discount non-European manufacture. I am unable to offer any insight as the mark is not legible enough, for me at least, to make, even at best, an educated guess. I hope more qualified members will join in, nevertheless a nice piece regardless of origin.
Regards,
Norman.

Jim McDougall · 30th April 2009, 12:33 AM

Hi Artzi,
Beautiful Piso!
I think your call to post this here is well placed, as I do believe this blade is indeed European, and likely one of the many trade blades and blades of this type which were exported from Solingen in the late 17th into the 18th c.
This blade type is most often seen on the kaskaras of North Africa, particularly those found in the Darfur province of western Sudan.
I'll have to check references for more, but these blades certainly went other directions in the well established trade routes, and this is intriguing to see one on a Piso.

All the best,
Jim

Jim McDougall · 1st May 2009, 03:11 AM

After my posting, I noticed Norman's very well observed post, and agree that there are certain similarities to the range of blades codified in Oakeshott's typology, in this case the Type X ("The Sword in the Age of Chivalry" p.28). Since these are from the medieval period noted by Norman, it does seem highly improbable that this would be that early. We do know that these European broadsword blades were prevalent products of Germany, and were widely exported, with many, as I noted, entering the North African sphere. These seem to date mostly from the 17th-18th century, however there are cases where the 16th century period is represented, and these may not have entered these regions until much later.

The blade on this piso podang seems to have a center channel that extends virtually to the point, and I am still trying to find the kaskara examples I have seen with this type blade. The Reed article on Darfur kaskaras I thought showed one like this, but I was mistaken. I still believe this is most probably a Solingen blade which may be indeed 17th century and agree possibly earlier.

I am very curious about the marking, which is partially obscured and can only make out that it seems to be an inscribed image, maybe a bird/dove or something of that nature from what I can see.

The blade being mounted in a piso podang truly is interesting, as it seems that they are typically mounted with various sabre blades, many of which are European.

best regards,
Jim

29th April 2009, 09:00 PM	#1
Oriental-Arms Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Haifa, Israel Posts: 183	Sword from Sumatara with early European Blade I was hesitating if to post this thread in the Ethnographic forum but as the blade here is the most interesting part I finally voted for the European armory forum: This sword, also known as *Piso Podang* is coming from Sumatra, Indonesia and usually associated with the Batak people. I have seen many similar swords employing any available blade, but this one is very interesting, as its blade I believe is early European, 17 C. or even earlier: Blade length 31 inches. Central nice long fuller 28 inches long: There is a what might be a maker mark just below the Langet: I will appreciate any suggestions on the blade age and/or origin

29th April 2009, 11:50 PM	#2
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,592	Hi, The appearance of this blade would probably place it, according to the usual typology, as an Xa or thereabouts. This type was most commonly used from the 11th through to the end of the 13th Cent. Although not impossible it is highly improbable that the blade would be in this age range therefore I think that the key to determining age/origin would be through the engraving. With this in mind I wouldn't discount non-European manufacture. I am unable to offer any insight as the mark is not legible enough, for me at least, to make, even at best, an educated guess. I hope more qualified members will join in, nevertheless a nice piece regardless of origin. Regards, Norman.

30th April 2009, 12:33 AM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,896	Hi Artzi, Beautiful Piso! I think your call to post this here is well placed, as I do believe this blade is indeed European, and likely one of the many trade blades and blades of this type which were exported from Solingen in the late 17th into the 18th c. This blade type is most often seen on the kaskaras of North Africa, particularly those found in the Darfur province of western Sudan. I'll have to check references for more, but these blades certainly went other directions in the well established trade routes, and this is intriguing to see one on a Piso. All the best, Jim

1st May 2009, 03:11 AM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,896	After my posting, I noticed Norman's very well observed post, and agree that there are certain similarities to the range of blades codified in Oakeshott's typology, in this case the Type X ("The Sword in the Age of Chivalry" p.28). Since these are from the medieval period noted by Norman, it does seem highly improbable that this would be that early. We do know that these European broadsword blades were prevalent products of Germany, and were widely exported, with many, as I noted, entering the North African sphere. These seem to date mostly from the 17th-18th century, however there are cases where the 16th century period is represented, and these may not have entered these regions until much later. The blade on this piso podang seems to have a center channel that extends virtually to the point, and I am still trying to find the kaskara examples I have seen with this type blade. The Reed article on Darfur kaskaras I thought showed one like this, but I was mistaken. I still believe this is most probably a Solingen blade which may be indeed 17th century and agree possibly earlier. I am very curious about the marking, which is partially obscured and can only make out that it seems to be an inscribed image, maybe a bird/dove or something of that nature from what I can see. The blade being mounted in a piso podang truly is interesting, as it seems that they are typically mounted with various sabre blades, many of which are European. best regards, Jim