Megantoro

A. G. Maisey · 6th April 2010, 01:38 AM

Thank you Pak Ganja.

So, would an accurate list of the ricikan that are found in keris dhapur megantoro be:-

luk tujuh, gonjo wilut, ada-ada, kembang kacang pogok, lambe gajah satu, jalen satu, kruwingan, greneng ?

Is there anything that I have ommitted?

Yes, I agree with you that this seems like a tangguh Majapahit keris dhapur, well, East Jawa at least.

ganjawulung · 6th April 2010, 03:35 AM

Yes, Alan. And the last luk is longer, and even straight at the tip of the blade. So, always combination of keris with luks and straight at the tip of the blade... Perhaps Empu Supa's style, IMHO...

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung · 6th April 2010, 03:49 AM

Will it be exagerated, if I supposed that this popular Si Ginje in the collection of the National Museum of Indonesia also was made by the same Empu? Empu Supa of Majapahit kingdom? Or which Supa? Look at the style and ornaments of this Sumatran keris...

GANJAWULUNG

A. G. Maisey · 6th April 2010, 04:09 AM

Thank you Pak Ganja.

So there is only one kembang kacang?

As you would appreciate, the attribution of a blade to a particular maker is very difficult. I'm well aware of the conventions that attribute blades to various makers upon the similarity in styles to agreed standards, however, if we were to accept without question these conventions, I think Empu Kinom must have produced maybe 10,000 blades or more during his lifetime. Quite incredible production. Similar production numbers can be attributed to other well known and popular makers also.

So, when we look at a couple of blades and see some similarities in those blades, I really do feel it is drawing a very long bow to attribute to the same maker.

It might be more wise to attribute to the same school, as we do with art works in other fields that possess similar characteristics.

ganjawulung · 6th April 2010, 04:27 AM

Yes, Alan, I agree. The same school... Coincidentally, with the same luk -- 7 luks -- and the same style with kruwingan at 3/4 of the blade, and "gelung" (kanyut) at the end of the greneng...

GANJAWULUNG

A. G. Maisey · 6th April 2010, 04:59 AM

Probably no coincidence, but intentional.

However --- one kembang kacang in megantoro?

Refresh my memory, if you would please, Pak Ganja. Briefly, what is the history of Si Ginje? Who was its first custodian?

ganjawulung · 6th April 2010, 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Probably no coincidence, but intentional.
However --- one kembang kacang in megantoro?
Refresh my memory, if you would please, Pak Ganja. Briefly, what is the history of Si Ginje? Who was its first custodian?

Yes, Alan, one kembang kacang only but pogok in a specific style -- like "paruh ayam jago". On history of Si Ginjei, or Si Ginjai please refer to this old thread
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=ginje

GANJAWULUNG

6th April 2010, 03:49 AM	#3
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	THE SAME EMPU? Will it be exagerated, if I supposed that this popular Si Ginje in the collection of the National Museum of Indonesia also was made by the same Empu? Empu Supa of Majapahit kingdom? Or which Supa? Look at the style and ornaments of this Sumatran keris... GANJAWULUNG Attached Images Last edited by ganjawulung; 6th April 2010 at 04:00 AM.

6th April 2010, 04:27 AM	#5
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	Yes, Alan, I agree. The same school... Coincidentally, with the same luk -- 7 luks -- and the same style with kruwingan at 3/4 of the blade, and "gelung" (kanyut) at the end of the greneng... GANJAWULUNG Last edited by ganjawulung; 6th April 2010 at 11:59 PM.

6th April 2010, 01:38 AM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,013	Thank you Pak Ganja. So, would an accurate list of the ricikan that are found in keris dhapur megantoro be:- luk tujuh, gonjo wilut, ada-ada, kembang kacang pogok, lambe gajah satu, jalen satu, kruwingan, greneng ? Is there anything that I have ommitted? Yes, I agree with you that this seems like a tangguh Majapahit keris dhapur, well, East Jawa at least.

6th April 2010, 03:35 AM	#2
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	Yes, Alan. And the last luk is longer, and even straight at the tip of the blade. So, always combination of keris with luks and straight at the tip of the blade... Perhaps Empu Supa's style, IMHO... GANJAWULUNG

6th April 2010, 04:09 AM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,013	Thank you Pak Ganja. So there is only one kembang kacang? As you would appreciate, the attribution of a blade to a particular maker is very difficult. I'm well aware of the conventions that attribute blades to various makers upon the similarity in styles to agreed standards, however, if we were to accept without question these conventions, I think Empu Kinom must have produced maybe 10,000 blades or more during his lifetime. Quite incredible production. Similar production numbers can be attributed to other well known and popular makers also. So, when we look at a couple of blades and see some similarities in those blades, I really do feel it is drawing a very long bow to attribute to the same maker. It might be more wise to attribute to the same school, as we do with art works in other fields that possess similar characteristics.

6th April 2010, 04:59 AM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,013	Probably no coincidence, but intentional. However --- one kembang kacang in megantoro? Refresh my memory, if you would please, Pak Ganja. Briefly, what is the history of Si Ginje? Who was its first custodian?