Medieval Welsh Weaponry

[fearn]

And whatever you do, don't forget about longbows and brown bills!

Best,

F

[Jim McDougall]

I guess it should be remembered that one of the most legendary swords of all was Excalibur as known in French versions of Geoffrey of Monmouths 12th century work "Historia Regum Britanniae", of course with the legend of King Arthur. The Welsh term was Caliburnus (Latinized). It is further very interesting that last year near Monmouth, Wales there was a sword stud excavated, one of the very few finds on this extremely little known part of this history of the Anglo Saxon dark ages in these regions.

Another term for sword in Welsh was caladbolg which seems to have derived or been associated with figures in Irish mythology. The Excalibur legend seems to have counterparts in Norse and other mythology.
In Welsh tradition there was a dagger named Carnwennan as well as spear named Rhongomniad as well as a ceremonial sword of peace named Clarent.
No long bows found yet Fearn !! nor what thier names were. To me one of the most fascinating things is the Welsh language itself, and how completely unique it seems alongside the English language.

Just thought I would add this,
All the best,
Jim

[fearn]

Hi Jim and all,

It's a common story that the English longbow developed from a Welsh predecessor. I don't know the origin of this story, but I figure it's probably true, given how the English traditionally felt about the Welsh.

As for the others, "bolg" means belly, or possibly lightning, and caladbolg means "hard belly" or possibly "hard lightning. Cuchulainn had a spear called "gae bolg" (belly spear or spear of light) Not sure why Celtic mythology has so many bolgs (including the fir bolg) but there you have it.

Best,

F

[Jim McDougall]

Thanks Fearn, really never knew much of this aspect of the British history but its pretty interesting, glad Josh posted it.

[jswillems]

Thank you all for your replies. I really appreciate the help. I will look into those books mentioned. I am really interested in the history of the area of Wales. I first became interested in it because my family has strong Welsh ties and I'm also interested in genealogy. I tried learning to speak Welsh a while ago, but never got far. Thanks again for the help.

- Josh

[Hotspur]

Originally Posted by fearn

Hi Jim and all,

It's a common story that the English longbow developed from a Welsh predecessor. I don't know the origin of this story, but I figure it's probably true, given how the English traditionally felt about the Welsh.

As for the others, "bolg" means belly, or possibly lightning, and caladbolg means "hard belly" or possibly "hard lightning. Cuchulainn had a spear called "gae bolg" (belly spear or spear of light) Not sure why Celtic mythology has so many bolgs (including the fir bolg) but there you have it.

Best,

F

However,

In what I have read over the years regarding the "modern" Ed the Ist longbow development was Scandanavian southern plains Brit ish heritage and not the mountain Welsh tribes who used short hunting bows shown strung drawn to the chest and not man/long length bows drawn to the ear. If I recall correctly, it is actually Edward that first employed the longbow against the Welsh in early campaigns (I will find the battles if they seem scarce to others but this should be elementary history research for any). By the time of the 100 years war, Richard II was a darling amongst mid medieval Welshmen militaries and the infamous Cheshire archers that later blindly (and were falsely) led by the Percy camp to rise against Henry IV. Shrewsbury possibly being the epitome of British longbow warfare on both sides of that battle. Edward the oneth use of the longbow squads was to protect the more mobile and fellow spearmen. Again, I am abstracting but the notes of those actions of longbow development on the island are out there.

What particular age of medieval is the paper to address? We are looking at five centuries and more in that regard but the arms of the Welsh by 1066 and all that mostly regard the influences of other Norman and more Norse backgrounds. There is some mystical fancy in my mind that some seem to think the Welsh less organized or structured than the rest of the world. Check out Madoc on your way through mythologies as well.

The Medieval Sourcebook web pages http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/Sbook.html might help any and any graced with JSTOR access has the informations at their finger tips. Welsh arms before Ed I also include Roman and other Scandanavian influences of arms. Swords were already well formed and implemented by those owing them and showed no real outstanding ethnographic traits before Norse intermingling of the islands at large.

Look also to the writings and compilations of earlier English history by Thomas Walsingham (toss Froissart in the bucket in regard to the Welsh, you'd be better off reading Shakespeare). Also the British history online site
www.british-history.ac.uk/Default.aspx with the old histories, as well as
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ Also a great portal that pretty much began my internet interests early in the game is the Sir Clisto Tome and indexes
www.sirclisto.com/ Yes, SCCA but quite a list to browse and leads to the real depths of data well beyond poor old Ewart, et al.

Cheers

GC

[Hotspur]

Josh,

If your interests of Welsh history is in the colonial American period, feel free to ping me as it is my heritage as well. Although my surname has been bound up by researchers insisting one source or another, the migration patterns from the Virginias, then south along known highways and byways then through the Carolinas and out through Cumberland shadowing Boone and others is a great escape to families histories. Look well to Charleston archives for entries as well but a lot of the settlement of families actually did migrate south as opposed to entry there.

Cheers

GC

[fearn]

Hi Hotspur,

You're probably right, but the deep archeological evidence from all over Europe (British Isles and mainland) shows that longbows were widespread throughout, from the mesolithic. For example the oldest longbow in the British Isles was exhumed from Ashcott Heath, Somerset dated to 2665 BCE (link).

There's a couple of things going on here. One is the physical size of the weapon itself, the other is fielding contingents of archers. It looks like the Welsh fighters were the impetus for the English longbows.

F

[Hotspur]

A wiki article?