The visible part of gonjo when Keris sheathed

BluErf · 3rd February 2010, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sipakatuo

Dear Gustav

This is my opnion and to the extend of my limited knowledge.
Speaking about setting of Ganja (Kancing in Bugis term) I saw many style of them in my home town Sulawesi. So it is difficult to say which one is the right setting. Plenty of them just flat, when I say flat means a level with the mouth of warangka, some even slightly sank into the warangka, few shown the upper level or buntut cicak. Through my research in Sulawesi I found no philosophy, reference, or whatsoever about this issue or the knowledge about it has been buried. So I believe it is just a matter of our own preference. The high setting of buntut cicak could be just to make it attractive.

However, I know that in Malaysia dan Singapore they have other opinion about this issue.

Speaking about the setting of gonjo, here I want to share my family's heirlooms and they are as originals as you can see.

Btw, I am just a collector not a dealer or runner. I am here to exchange opinion with you and the rest of members. No point of getting famous or to be acknowledge by everyone. I believe if you have brain and want to be someone then you need to make a book and let other people judge you, by then you can measure your knowledge!. Just read previous threads about the need to claim own identity. My full name is quite long so just call me Andi or Irvan and I live in Jakarta. Thanks and have a nice weekend to everyone.

Hi Sipakatuo,

Thanks for sharing your family heirlooms. Could I enquire if the toli-toli were attached in recent times? The reason for my asking is that the rope do look pretty modern, especially the pink one. What is the reason for attaching the toli-toli? Thanks!

Regards,
Kai Wee

sipakatuo · 6th February 2010, 11:23 AM

Hai Kai Wee

It is not Toli-Toli, it is called Passiosumange or Passingkerrusumange. There is a difference between Toli-Toli and Passingkerrusumange. Toli-Toli in Bugis means Ear Ring and you can commonly find this object attached in Wanua (Warangka) of Badik or sometimes in Tappi (Keris) too. Passingkerrusumange is the loop itself. It means 'Pengikat Semangat' or knot of spirit. You are correct, the loop here is new because the old one was damaged and so I have to replace it. Passingkerrusumange is also representing a status, in the old days before they wrap this loop around the Wanua, they must spell a mantra. The purpose is to give this loop a spirit (semangat). So whenever we travel along with this Tappi it can give us a 'sign' before bad things happen at home. This is just a belief and culture of the Buginesse in the old days.
There is actually other purpose of it and maybe next time...

Andi Irvan

BluErf · 7th February 2010, 12:57 AM

Hello Sipakatuo, thanks for sharing the information!

Wow, this is interesting indeed. Look forward to part II. Thanks!

sipakatuo · 7th February 2010, 03:43 AM

Woww No Worries Mate...

sirek · 8th February 2010, 06:29 PM

hello sipakatuo, very interesting.

is it maybe possible you can you show us how make a properlyToli Toli /Passiosumange/Passingkerrusumange?

are there certain rules, or prescribed dimensions ?

I think it gives the keris a better appearance.

David · 8th February 2010, 08:09 PM

Toli-Toli is a district in Sulawesi. Is this where the name for the sheath adornment comes from or is it because it resembles and earring as Sipakatuo suggests?

sipakatuo · 9th February 2010, 08:55 AM

Hi David and Sirek

It is not related to the district.
Toli simply earring, I might have to upload pictures of toli and passingkerru sumange later.

Sirek, just wait. I will be uploading it soon.

kerisbiz · 11th August 2016, 08:12 AM

In my opinion, the correct position is singkerrusumange like this picture. You can see the position of the royal kris Bugis and Makassar all put in that position. Because in Bugis culture there is a philosophy of the head, torso, and legs in the design of traditional houses as well as weapons.

6th February 2010, 11:23 AM	#2
sipakatuo Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 59	Hai Kai Wee It is not Toli-Toli, it is called Passiosumange or Passingkerrusumange. There is a difference between Toli-Toli and Passingkerrusumange. Toli-Toli in Bugis means Ear Ring and you can commonly find this object attached in Wanua (Warangka) of Badik or sometimes in Tappi (Keris) too. Passingkerrusumange is the loop itself. It means 'Pengikat Semangat' or knot of spirit. You are correct, the loop here is new because the old one was damaged and so I have to replace it. Passingkerrusumange is also representing a status, in the old days before they wrap this loop around the Wanua, they must spell a mantra. The purpose is to give this loop a spirit (semangat). So whenever we travel along with this Tappi it can give us a 'sign' before bad things happen at home. This is just a belief and culture of the Buginesse in the old days. There is actually other purpose of it and maybe next time... Andi Irvan

7th February 2010, 12:57 AM	#3
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	Hello Sipakatuo, thanks for sharing the information! Wow, this is interesting indeed. Look forward to part II. Thanks!

7th February 2010, 03:43 AM	#4
sipakatuo Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 59	Woww No Worries Mate...

8th February 2010, 06:29 PM	#5
sirek Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 170	hello sipakatuo, very interesting. is it maybe possible you can you show us how make a properlyToli Toli /Passiosumange/Passingkerrusumange? are there certain rules, or prescribed dimensions ? I think it gives the keris a better appearance.

8th February 2010, 08:09 PM	#6
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Toli-Toli is a district in Sulawesi. Is this where the name for the sheath adornment comes from or is it because it resembles and earring as Sipakatuo suggests?

9th February 2010, 08:55 AM	#7
sipakatuo Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 59	Hi David and Sirek It is not related to the district. Toli simply earring, I might have to upload pictures of toli and passingkerru sumange later. Sirek, just wait. I will be uploading it soon.

11th August 2016, 08:12 AM	#8
kerisbiz Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 15	In my opinion, the correct position is singkerrusumange like this picture. You can see the position of the royal kris Bugis and Makassar all put in that position. Because in Bugis culture there is a philosophy of the head, torso, and legs in the design of traditional houses as well as weapons.