Somalian Billao

Conogre · 14th May 2005, 01:55 PM

That's another of the knives that keeps escaping me, but I'm sure I'll find one eventually...yours is a very nice specimen, by the way.
I find the asymetrical blade fascinating, as well as the unusual pommel arrangement usually seen on them, with both features found on another knife/sword from the general region, the Jile' or Gile', I believe from the Afar people, another case where a tribal weapon's features evolved throughout the region.
Mike

tom hyle · 14th May 2005, 02:36 PM

The two seem to be pretty much versions of each other, with (shades of matulis/talibon, but don't ask me for examples, please!) intermediary forms.
Tim, are you saying the spacers are always/traditionally zinc? I've taken ones I've seen for lead, and they seem to be composed of layers of almost foil-like thin-ness. Mind you I wouldn't recognize unmixed zinc......so what's the deal?

Aurangzeb · 14th May 2005, 03:42 PM

Hi all!

Like I said earlier the handle is horn but I do not know what type of horn.Any one have any guesses on what it might be?I gussed rhino horn but I am not sure.Does the shape of the butcap/pommel have to do with a diffrent region of Somalia?(1 spike or 3 spike shapes)Does anyone know about why these spacers are put in there and why the handle and blade are so thin?Sorry for so many questions but I find the horn of africa a facenating place.

P.S.-Why does it seem that zinc or lead spacers more previlent than brass,I whould think it whould be the other way around.

tom hyle · 14th May 2005, 04:43 PM

I've wondered about that; a vague guess is some odd convenience of old trade routes and international markets; it seems to be industrial sheet metal?
As for the thin-ness of the blades, that is part of a long and widespread African tradition; it's discussed on a fairly recent thread about ceremonial African weapons. There's disagreement, but I feel it comes out of traditional and martial weapon philosophies. It's certainly typical; gilles are thicker AFAIK. The fine, hollow-bevelled forming of these thin blades entirely by handforging amazes me.
I've heard something about the spikes, but don't remember.....The guards and pommels are fitted with an obsessiveness to please any European, and are often the ground for some tiny and sometimes intricate geometric line engraving.
The sheath looks old to me, why not? The unusual feature to my experience it the belt-hanging slots; the one I had had a belt sewn to it.

Aurangzeb · 14th May 2005, 04:56 PM

Hi Tom!

I find it odd that they wear belts in Somalia.In the very good book"African Arms and Armour" on Pg.-106 picture 104 of a Souther Somali man wearing a dagger similer to mine.But why are Billao's also referrd to as Belawa's.Is it Pronaunced BILL-A-O or BILL-OH.Do you think that these spiky pommels came out of a need to impess european buyers or is it personal taste.

tom hyle · 14th May 2005, 05:54 PM

I find that multiple spellings can be a good hint to pronouncing

I don't think that wearing a belt just to be wearing one is a traditional Somali thing (?), and I think the traditional skirts just tie on. Of course, the traditional belt is sewn to the sheath, similarly to the bracelet on arm daggers, so that's different. I suspect the slots on your sheath may relate to a modern military belt for carring things on. I don't think they'd take a "web" belt (?) but leather belts with looped pouches, sheaths, etc. was previously the European standard, and may still prevail with some armies (?).

Aurangzeb · 14th May 2005, 10:08 PM

Hi Tom!

The belt loop is to small for a web belt but fits a standard leather belt nicely,(I know this only by measuring,I can not get a belt through it)I find that very interesting how a late 19th. century dagger might have a relativly modern military connection.(with all the Somalian waring clans this whould not surise me,the reuse of old weapons such as a billao.You are certainly right about the leather belts,although not used by most modern hi-tech armies the various militias and clans of africa/asia seem to be like europe's sell off yard for outdated war-gear.Like the two FT-17 light tanks the army found over in Afghanistan in a junkyard.

14th May 2005, 01:55 PM	#1
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	That's another of the knives that keeps escaping me, but I'm sure I'll find one eventually...yours is a very nice specimen, by the way. I find the asymetrical blade fascinating, as well as the unusual pommel arrangement usually seen on them, with both features found on another knife/sword from the general region, the Jile' or Gile', I believe from the Afar people, another case where a tribal weapon's features evolved throughout the region. Mike

14th May 2005, 02:36 PM	#2
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	The two seem to be pretty much versions of each other, with (shades of matulis/talibon, but don't ask me for examples, please!) intermediary forms. Tim, are you saying the spacers are always/traditionally zinc? I've taken ones I've seen for lead, and they seem to be composed of layers of almost foil-like thin-ness. Mind you I wouldn't recognize unmixed zinc......so what's the deal?

14th May 2005, 03:42 PM	#3
Aurangzeb Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 306	Hi all! Like I said earlier the handle is horn but I do not know what type of horn.Any one have any guesses on what it might be?I gussed rhino horn but I am not sure.Does the shape of the butcap/pommel have to do with a diffrent region of Somalia?(1 spike or 3 spike shapes)Does anyone know about why these spacers are put in there and why the handle and blade are so thin?Sorry for so many questions but I find the horn of africa a facenating place. P.S.-Why does it seem that zinc or lead spacers more previlent than brass,I whould think it whould be the other way around.

14th May 2005, 04:43 PM	#4
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	I've wondered about that; a vague guess is some odd convenience of old trade routes and international markets; it seems to be industrial sheet metal? As for the thin-ness of the blades, that is part of a long and widespread African tradition; it's discussed on a fairly recent thread about ceremonial African weapons. There's disagreement, but I feel it comes out of traditional and martial weapon philosophies. It's certainly typical; gilles are thicker AFAIK. The fine, hollow-bevelled forming of these thin blades entirely by handforging amazes me. I've heard something about the spikes, but don't remember.....The guards and pommels are fitted with an obsessiveness to please any European, and are often the ground for some tiny and sometimes intricate geometric line engraving. The sheath looks old to me, why not? The unusual feature to my experience it the belt-hanging slots; the one I had had a belt sewn to it.

14th May 2005, 04:56 PM	#5
Aurangzeb Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 306	Hi Tom! I find it odd that they wear belts in Somalia.In the very good book"African Arms and Armour" on Pg.-106 picture 104 of a Souther Somali man wearing a dagger similer to mine.But why are Billao's also referrd to as Belawa's.Is it Pronaunced BILL-A-O or BILL-OH.Do you think that these spiky pommels came out of a need to impess european buyers or is it personal taste.

14th May 2005, 05:54 PM	#6
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	I find that multiple spellings can be a good hint to pronouncing I don't think that wearing a belt just to be wearing one is a traditional Somali thing (?), and I think the traditional skirts just tie on. Of course, the traditional belt is sewn to the sheath, similarly to the bracelet on arm daggers, so that's different. I suspect the slots on your sheath may relate to a modern military belt for carring things on. I don't think they'd take a "web" belt (?) but leather belts with looped pouches, sheaths, etc. was previously the European standard, and may still prevail with some armies (?).

14th May 2005, 10:08 PM	#7
Aurangzeb Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 306	Hi Tom! The belt loop is to small for a web belt but fits a standard leather belt nicely,(I know this only by measuring,I can not get a belt through it)I find that very interesting how a late 19th. century dagger might have a relativly modern military connection.(with all the Somalian waring clans this whould not surise me,the reuse of old weapons such as a billao.You are certainly right about the leather belts,although not used by most modern hi-tech armies the various militias and clans of africa/asia seem to be like europe's sell off yard for outdated war-gear.Like the two FT-17 light tanks the army found over in Afghanistan in a junkyard.