Turkish Dagger Translation Help

[TVV]

I have a huge plea to the members of this forum, who can read Arabic for a translation, which is most likely from Turkish. A friend of mine in Bulgaria recently acquired this dagger, and is wondering if someone can read the inscriptions on the blade and on the scabbard.

Thank you very much in advance,

Teodor

[TVV]

Please disregard the scabbard, which is obviously newly made.
Thank you,
Teodor

[TVV]

Here are some more pictures - hoepfully someone can read the inscription or at least let me know that it is illegible.
Also, would anyone venture a guess on origin? Mine is Ottoman, 18th century.

Thank you,
Teodor

[Jeff D]

Hi Teodor,

While waiting for the definitive answer, my guess is that it is a Indian version of Asad Allaha Isfahan.

All the best
Jeff

[TVV]

Thank you very much Jeff,
My Ottoman attribution was based on the hilt, made of one piece of walrus ivory, and overzealously cleaned. This of course does not mean that the blade could not be Indian.
My friend tried to do a light etch, but apaprently there was no clear pattern, although I am assuming he has not given up just yet. I did not think of the possibility that the blade may be imported into the Ottoman Empire.
Again, thank you very much for your reply.
Teodor

[Jeff D]

Hi Teodor,

If I am correct (which is very far from certain), you might find a mechanical pattern.

All the Best
Jeff

[Dom]

Originally Posted by Jeff D

Hi Teodor,

While waiting for the definitive answer, my guess is that it is a Indian version of Asad Allaha Isfahan.

All the best
Jeff

Hi
the general aspect, and indeed the inlay looks "Indian",
but the mentions are in arabic,
on the blade
- in the "cartouche" at right, the Holy name of God "Allah"
- in the "cartouche" at left, the Holy name of the last Prophet "Mohamed"
- under the cartouche, the name of "Abdallah" (may be owner name ?)

on the scabbard;
"Amal Ahmed ???? Hussein"
"Made by Ahmed ???? Hussein"

due to all arabic mentions, doubtful that could be Ottoman, even Persian
dagger

à +

Dom

[TVV]

Dom,

Thank you very much! The scabbard is almost brand new, made a knifesmith in Bulgaria, who copied from somwhere - we can not use it for identification.

It seems that the general consensus is that the blade is Indian, with an Ottoman hilt. When it comes to names, such as Allah, Mohammed and Abdallah, is there a difference in the way they are written in Arabic, Turkish or Persian, or are they written in the same manner in all these labguages?

Best regards,
Teodor

[Dom]

Originally Posted by TVV

there a difference in the way they are written in Arabic, Turkish or Persian, or are they written in the same manner in all these labguages?

Hi Teodor
at least, in Turkish the name of Mohamed, become; Mehmet or Muhammed
but no change for; Allah or Abdallah (Abd Allah = Servant of God)

à +

Dom

[TVV]

Dom,

Isn't the name of the Prophet Mohamed written the same way everywhere in the Islamic world, from the Maghreb to Sumatra? If so, then the blade could be from virtually anywhere, right?

I am just wondering if names can be used to indicate whether the writing is Arabic or Turkish.

Thank you,
Teodor

[Dom]

Originally Posted by TVV

Isn't the name of the Prophet Mohamed written the same way everywhere in the Islamic world, from the Maghreb to Sumatra?

the people are writing, as they are speaking ... logic
in West Africa e.i. "Mamadou" means "Mohamed" ...

à +

Dom

[TVV]

Originally Posted by Dom

the people are writing, as they are speaking ... logic
in West Africa e.i. "Mamadou" means "Mohamed" ...

à +

Dom

Dom,

Thanks for the clarification - I thought there was a cannon when it came to the spelling of the Prophet's name and did not realize it could vary based on the local pronounciation.

I guess this means the blade is not Turkish or persian, which means India is a very likely option.

Thank you,
Teodor