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22nd July 2009, 11:39 PM
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#1 |
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Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
Posts: 10,284
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Good observations Gene, and while I cannot think of a blade with serpent suggesting poison as far as the marking, the Tanjore katars with the cobra projecting from the bottom of the hilt suggesting poisoned blade seems plausible.
The punji stakes are a grim example of rather crude, but effective use of biological poison. I think the term is SE Asian and these are known by about late 19th century, but of course notoriously known from Vietnam later. In "Magic, Murder and Medicine" (John Mann, 1992, p.23) found more on what type of poison may have been used on medieval blades. It is noted that, "...aconite was also the most widely used arrow poison in medieval Europe, and was still in use in the Iberian Peninsula as late as the 17th c.". Apparantly aconite was used as early as ancient Greece, and may have been the poison used as early as the arrow poisons described in the 'Rig Veda". It seems the use of poisons on arrows was primarily for hunting, in tribal regions of South America, where the poisons used were from plant extracts that were not likely to be absorbed enough or in a manner to taint the meat. These seem to have been prepared in graduated measure, noted by one tree, two tree or three tree reference....the interesting use of the term tree indicating how many trees a wounded monkey could jump impacted by the poison. The three tree would enable live capture of the animal. These poisons seem to have been variants of curare, known to Europe esoterically by the 16th century, but certainly not widely known until latter 19th century. The poison is used in one of the Sherlock Holmes mysteries. In Africa, there are deadly poisons such as strophanthus gratus , reported by Livingston that could 'stop an elephant', again a 19th century account. It would seem that aconite may have been the poison present in the blades of late medieval to Renaissance Europe. Perhaps more research will tell more. All best regards, Jim |
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23rd July 2009, 12:55 AM
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#2 |
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Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,247
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Actually, since I've got a cut that I'm keeping clean right now, I did have a non-random thought.
In the long run, the purpose of poisoning a blade is to kill someone. But in the short run (i.e. in a fight) it might be equally useful to put an irritant on the blade, so that even a minor nick hurts like iodine...excuse me...blazes. Sorry that slipped out  Anyway, the flinch from getting hit by an irritant (toxic or not) might be useful in a fight. Just a thought. Guess it shows where my mind is when I'm swapping out a bandage. Best, F |
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23rd July 2009, 01:22 PM
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#3 | |
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Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
Posts: 10,284
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Quote:
Hi Fearn, Actually that tactic is something actually used in certain degree in various combat with edged weapons, and distracting wounds were often part of the strategy. I believe in fencing, that is actual duelling, there is a slashing cut termed the stramazone (if memory serves) which ideally on the forehead, causes bleeding into the eyes. Other cuts to the wrist (in Scottish broadswords) or sword arm were obviously to disable the opponent. The only thing that would diminish the prospect of pain as a distraction in edged weapon combat would be that the adrenalin would pretty much negate that particular dynamic. It seems in any type of heated combat, one is often entirely unaware of many key wounds which are not realized until the action subsides. You are right though, there is a merciful numbing of pain in major wounds in most cases in normal circumstances, but a minor accidental cut without the presence of adrenalin.....ouch!!!! Be careful when you're playin' with those blades!!  All the best, Jim |
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23rd July 2009, 09:19 PM
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#4 |
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Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,247
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Hi Jim,
While I can't speak to the effect of irritants on blades, I do know that tear gas and pepper spray are routinely used in combat situations. Yes, they are blinders, but they are primarily irritants. The point of the irritant is to make someone pay attention to their wounds, even involuntarily. I don't know of any human deliberately putting irritants on blades, but it's certainly the effect of things like wasp-stings. Wasp venom ( and probably bee venom, depending on species) is full of things like histamine that cause pain as well as tissue damage. Very little wasp venom is needed to get you to notice that you've been stung. In any case, if this wasn't part of the reason they used to poison blades, maybe in the future, martial artists will start putting capsaicin and histamine concoctions on their "less lethal" weapons, or some such...Hmmmm. F |
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