Of bolo rush & bolomen

[KuKulzA28]

WOW! I did not know about the Talibon/garab sundang, that's very cool...
It's interesting when people, even historians and martial artists, make blanket statements like "Talibon were only weapons" or "all Filipino weaponry had a duality of purpose - war and work" or "weapons are an extension of the hand" or "all bladed techniques can have hand and stick techniques derived from them"etc.etc. From life-experience it seems thing aren't always so clear-cut

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Originally Posted by migueldiaz

Thanks for your interest in this topic!

OT: By the way, your avatar is really cool. Would you mind sharing to us what the character means?

That's my family-name: Tseng, I am what's known as Huh-lwo, Hoklo, or Hokkien. I have the Chinese character and Aboriginal symbols to show my mixed ancestry. I'm Taiwanese American. Many of the Chinese in Indonesia, Philippines, SE Asia, India, etc. were from Hoklo traders/pirates/settlers/coolies. More than 80% of the Taiwanese Hoklos are estimated to have some amount of aboriginal blood. A Taiwanese Aborigine blade is resting on a skull - we can assume a headhunted skull . The diamond pattern is from the popular Paiwan/Puyuma/Ruaki motifs of the bai-bu-shuh or hundred paces snake.

I have a huge interest in Southern China, Taiwan, Philippines, Indonesia, India, Congo, and Latin America - cultures, history, canoes, climate, weapinry, martial arts, women, food - you name it.

----what does yours mean?

[Dimasalang]

Originally Posted by KuKulzA28

----what does yours mean?

Miguels is Alibata/Baybayin script. It is old writing from the Philippines that is pre-Spanish. The first book ever published by the Spanish in the Philippines(Doctrina Cristiana in 1593, or Christian Doctrine) was written in Alibata in order to convert the natives. The writing in Miguels avatar looks to be the "La" character...both together I am guessing would be "Lala"...not sure what that means though, maybe his Filipino pet name. hehe Some Filipinos still signed their names in Alibata up until the mid-19th century...so it is not as if it all disappeared when the Spanish took over. The Katipunan also placed the "Ka" alibata symbol in the middle of some of their flags...not to represent "Katipunan" but for "Kalayaan"(independence). Today there are some tribes and places that still use that writing to communicate(Mindoro and Palawan being the two most recognized places). Many Filipinos now are understanding its importance and are embracing it...myself included.
Sorry Miguel, thought I'd help myself to your question.

[Lew]

I found an old news reel from 1943 it shows Philippine troops being armed with bolos. It's about 5 minutes into the video.

http://ahivfree.alexanderstreet.com/View/526281

[carlos]

Originally Posted by LOUIEBLADES

I found an old news reel from 1943 it shows Philippine troops being armed with bolos. It's about 5 minutes into the video.

http://ahivfree.alexanderstreet.com/View/526281

Could somebody put a picture of one bolo like the video? thanks
carlos

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by carlos

Could somebody put a picture of one bolo like the video? thanks
carlos

Hola Carlos! I don't have one but I posted some video grab as can be seen above ... Hope somebody can post a pic from his own collection ...

[trenchwarfare]

Originally Posted by migueldiaz

Hola Carlos! I don't have one but I posted some video grab as can be seen above ... Hope somebody can post a pic from his own collection ...

The Bolos in the video are not locally made. They are of US mfg., made by the US Spring & Bumper Co. Los Angeles Ca. They have molded green rubber handles with co. logo cast in, and star pattern grip. Blades, and guards are plated. Came with a very flimsey canvas scabbard, but the standard 18" machete scabbard fits perfectly. I sold one on ebay a while back. Will try to find pictures. Couldn't find one, back when I was collecting WWII US edged weapons.

[carlos]

Originally Posted by trenchwarfare

The Bolos in the video are not locally made. They are of US mfg., made by the US Spring & Bumper Co. Los Angeles Ca. They have molded green rubber handles with co. logo cast in, and star pattern grip. Blades, and guards are plated. Came with a very flimsey canvas scabbard, but the standard 18" machete scabbard fits perfectly. I sold one on ebay a while back. Will try to find pictures. Couldn't find one, back when I was collecting WWII US edged weapons.

Thank you very much !! this information is very fine to me!1
Thanks again
carlos

[KuKulzA28]

Thanks Dimasalang!

@ LOUIEBLADES:
Oh wow, that's wicked cool, I like how the text follows the video clip...
Interesting how the Filipino soldiers were issued bolos by the US Army...

I bet they would've brought bolos even if they weren't issued them

This reminds me of Crossing the Sulu Seas where an old man relates of how he remembers Moro krismen ambushing Japanese forces. It seems a common theme with the Filipinos, Moros, Gorkhas, Chinese, Taiwanese, etc. to use a big native blade since guns and ammo were low.

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by KuKulzA28

Interesting how the Filipino soldiers were issued bolos by the US Army...

Certain elite units of the present Philippine Marines are still issued bolos (e.g., ginunting), even up to now.

On where to buy them, kindly check out this post.

[Dimasalang]

Originally Posted by migueldiaz

Certain elite units of the present Philippine Marines are still issued bolos (e.g., ginunting), even up to now.

On where to buy them, kindly check out this post.

I actually bought a ginunting from Buddy last Dec. It was a Xmas present to myself. Buddy makes them for the Philippine Marine elite unit. They practice pekiti tirsia under Leo Gaje...and this is their weapon of choice and it is made to their specs.


I just have to add...it is extremely well balanced and light. The Kamagong handles make it look heavy but it is not. Very easy to swing, chop, hack, thrust, etc... And Buddy is a great guy to deal with.

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by Dimasalang

I actually bought a ginunting from Buddy last Dec. It was a Xmas present to myself. Buddy makes them for the Philippine Marine elite unit ...

Which reminds me, I've been meaning to get one for myself, too!

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by Dimasalang

I just have to add...it is extremely well balanced and light. The Kamagong handles make it look heavy but it is not. Very easy to swing, chop, hack, thrust, etc... And Buddy is a great guy to deal with.

By the way, would you know if the Phil. Army (with US troops below, in the 2008 joint exercise in Luzon) would also have a standard issue bolo? Thanks.

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by LOUIEBLADES

I found an old news reel from 1943 it shows Philippine troops being armed with bolos. It's about 5 minutes into the video. http://ahivfree.alexanderstreet.com/View/526281

Thanks Lew for the link! That's a very cool find

For quick reference, the narration went:

Narrator: A regiment of Filipino infantry in the United States army receives the one weapon they know best, the Philippine bolo knife. Used in cutting through jungles, the bolo is equally effective in hand-to-hand combat. Filipinos, young and old, have a long and outstanding score to (inaudible ) with the Japanese invaders of their native land. Today, armed with native weapons, augmenting their modern equipment, they are eager to meet the enemy.

Below are some stills from the video.

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by Dimasalang

Miguels is Alibata/Baybayin script. It is old writing from the Philippines that is pre-Spanish ... Sorry Miguel, thought I'd help myself to your question.

Dimasalang, maraming salamat po [many thanks]!

Yes indeed, alibata is still very much alive. And per my earlier post we can even see alibata characters in some old Phil. swords ...

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by KuKulzA28

It's interesting when people, even historians and martial artists, make blanket statements like "Talibon were only weapons" or "all Filipino weaponry had a duality of purpose - war and work" or "weapons are an extension of the hand" or "all bladed techniques can have hand and stick techniques derived from them"etc.etc. From life-experience it seems thing aren't always so clear-cut

I definitely agree that more often, things are not clear-cut.

In a spectrum where one extreme is "tool-only" and the other is "weapon-only", I think most ethnic blades would lie somewhere in between.

Occasionally you'll have the kampilan, etc. that's a weapon-only blade. At the moment I cannot think of a (Filipino) tool-only blade but I'm sure there's one.

But as you also said, the vast majority of ethnic blades would lie somewhere in between. And apparently that's true for the Samar-Leyte sundang as well.

Even the sinister-looking northern Luzon head-axe for instance, is used more often as a tool, rather than to smite an enemy, as noted earlier ...

Originally Posted by KuKulzA28

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That's my family-name: Tseng, I am what's known as Huh-lwo, Hoklo, or Hokkien. I have the Chinese character and Aboriginal symbols to show my mixed ancestry ... ----what does yours mean?

Thanks for sharing the meaning of the uber-cool avatar of yours!

The script in my avatar harks back to my family history. The characters mean "tamer of the serpent bakunawa, protector of the seas, and rider of the storm". Ok, ok, I just made that up! As Dimasalang explained, it's the ancient Philippine script (and the characters refer to my real name's initials).

And said alibata script can still be found occasionally in old Philippine swords (e.g. below).

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by KuKulzA28

It's interesting when people, even historians and martial artists, make blanket statements like "Talibon were only weapons" or "all Filipino weaponry had a duality of purpose - war and work" or "weapons are an extension of the hand" or "all bladed techniques can have hand and stick techniques derived from them"etc.etc. From life-experience it seems thing aren't always so clear-cut

I've been thinking, in the olden times perhaps it's really the agricultural [work] design of a blade that heavily influences martial arts [war] style ...

Like in any agricultural society in which economic surplus is not that much, most people can afford only one bolo. And so it makes sense to design the bolo around its intended agricultural use, as the community is engaged in farming most of the time anyway rather than in hacking other people

On the duality thing while not always true, we also see on the other hand that there indeed exist instances where the duality is there (i.e., work & war application is seen on the same blade, like the Leyte-Samar sundang).

Thus, whereas the Full Metal Jacket grunts have to chant

"This is my rifle. There are many like it but this one is mine. My rifle is my best friend. It is my life. I must master it as I must master my life. Without me, my rifle is useless. Without my rifle I am useless ..."

for the typical Filipino farmer of old, when pressed into military service there would be no need for such mantra