Chinese Jian

Gavin Nugent · 14th March 2008, 12:23 AM

Here it is guys and I very much welcome further advise and comments.

The Blade.

I finally cleaned all the grease and muck off the blade and thought to myself Blah, just a very boring bright shine blade and I could see no forging marks to the naked eye. I then looked at past forums on etching and cleaning and ran a few question by fellow collectors who provided good sound advise.

I followed instruction from Rick,(Thanks Rick) and proceeded to clean further and remove this shine to see if any pattern laid beneath.
I have only etched the blade once and quickly, the photos reveal what lay beneath the bright shine finish.
I do not wish to take this any further until I hear some more sound advise from readers and collectors.

From this discovery I have pondered a few questions.

Why is it that when I now apply polish, these lamenations disapear to the naked eye again?

Should I continue with etching, or polish, oil and preserve it as it is?

Should I return the blade to it's former high shine, grease it as it has been all these years and leave it?

What date would one assume this sword was produced?

I am guessing that this is one of those rare lucky finds as stated by others, being a long blade in full profile, inlay complete and well preserved since it's departure from it's original owner.

All the Best

Gav

josh stout · 14th March 2008, 05:33 PM

Very nice looking blade. We can stay with the Early Republican/late Qing dating, but as you know the blade could be older. As for etching, there are many opinions. Here is what I would do: Scrub the blade with soap and water, be very careful not to get any on the fittings. Remove any residual oils with Windex and perhaps finally acetone. Then when it is perfectly dry, put clear nail polish over the stars. They could fall out with etching otherwise. I etch mine with vinegar in a PVC tube as this gives an even result. I leave the tube next to the furnace so the temperature is about 35 C.. Then I leave it there for 18-24 hours. I take it out, neutralise it with baking soda, then scrub it again. This makes a clean shiny blade where once again the laminations are difficult to see. (they would be dark before the final scrubbing.) Now what you have done is create a bit of contour with the etching. I take 4000 grit paper and go over the blade. This highlights the lamination, and turns the high carbon steel bright and the low carbon dark. Without this if you just left the blade dark from etching, the high carbon is dark, and the low carbon bright. I prefer bright edges on a Chinese blade. I have not seen this particular approach described before, so I would be interested in others comments. I showed a blade I had treated this way to Scott Rodell, and he liked the way it looked very much.
Josh

Gavin Nugent · 15th March 2008, 09:41 AM

Hi Josh,

Can you show images of this blade in detail here please. I would like to see the final effect you speak of. I too would like to hear what others think of this method.

regards

Gav

Flavio · 15th March 2008, 01:00 PM

Yes Josh, please if you can post some pics

thank you

Gavin Nugent · 17th March 2008, 05:23 AM

Can any readers post a list of essential reading on the matter of Chinese swords?

regards

Gav

josh stout · 18th March 2008, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flavio

Yes Josh, please if you can post some pics

thank you

I have a backlog of pictures that need taking, but I will try and get to it as soon as I can. The technique is great for very active patterns and inserted edges, but only highlights the edges if the patterns are more subdued. Strangely it does not seem to work well on Tibetan style pattern welding where I thought the high contrast piled construction would show up well. I have had more luck on Tibetan things with the more normal approach of just a few hours in vinegar to darken, and then just a quick cleanup with 4000 paper. I am wondering if nitric might work better. Vinegar etches seem to bring out greys while I think nitric brings out more contrasting colors.

Here is a Tibetan style blade I did in the more normal method of etching. I think it turned out well, but the contrast is not as strong as would have liked. More of a pattern of greys than a true light and dark.
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j6...duation278.jpg
Josh

14th March 2008, 12:23 AM	#1
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	The Question you were all wondering about. Here it is guys and I very much welcome further advise and comments. The Blade. I finally cleaned all the grease and muck off the blade and thought to myself Blah, just a very boring bright shine blade and I could see no forging marks to the naked eye. I then looked at past forums on etching and cleaning and ran a few question by fellow collectors who provided good sound advise. I followed instruction from Rick,(Thanks Rick) and proceeded to clean further and remove this shine to see if any pattern laid beneath. I have only etched the blade once and quickly, the photos reveal what lay beneath the bright shine finish. I do not wish to take this any further until I hear some more sound advise from readers and collectors. From this discovery I have pondered a few questions. Why is it that when I now apply polish, these lamenations disapear to the naked eye again? Should I continue with etching, or polish, oil and preserve it as it is? Should I return the blade to it's former high shine, grease it as it has been all these years and leave it? What date would one assume this sword was produced? I am guessing that this is one of those rare lucky finds as stated by others, being a long blade in full profile, inlay complete and well preserved since it's departure from it's original owner. All the Best Gav Attached Images

15th March 2008, 09:41 AM	#3
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	Can you show this blade? Hi Josh, Can you show images of this blade in detail here please. I would like to see the final effect you speak of. I too would like to hear what others think of this method. regards Gav

17th March 2008, 05:23 AM	#5
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	books Can any readers post a list of essential reading on the matter of Chinese swords? regards Gav Last edited by freebooter; 17th March 2008 at 08:29 AM.

14th March 2008, 05:33 PM	#2
josh stout Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 407	Very nice looking blade. We can stay with the Early Republican/late Qing dating, but as you know the blade could be older. As for etching, there are many opinions. Here is what I would do: Scrub the blade with soap and water, be very careful not to get any on the fittings. Remove any residual oils with Windex and perhaps finally acetone. Then when it is perfectly dry, put clear nail polish over the stars. They could fall out with etching otherwise. I etch mine with vinegar in a PVC tube as this gives an even result. I leave the tube next to the furnace so the temperature is about 35 C.. Then I leave it there for 18-24 hours. I take it out, neutralise it with baking soda, then scrub it again. This makes a clean shiny blade where once again the laminations are difficult to see. (they would be dark before the final scrubbing.) Now what you have done is create a bit of contour with the etching. I take 4000 grit paper and go over the blade. This highlights the lamination, and turns the high carbon steel bright and the low carbon dark. Without this if you just left the blade dark from etching, the high carbon is dark, and the low carbon bright. I prefer bright edges on a Chinese blade. I have not seen this particular approach described before, so I would be interested in others comments. I showed a blade I had treated this way to Scott Rodell, and he liked the way it looked very much. Josh

15th March 2008, 01:00 PM	#4
Flavio Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Italia Posts: 1,243	Yes Josh, please if you can post some pics thank you