Cameroon/Nigerian?

fernando · 30th September 2007, 09:47 PM

Hi Tim
What a most interesting piece.
It doesn't look so modern ... how old could it be ?
What is the handle material?
One more question. Which is the sharpened section, the round outer part only ?
Thanks and regards
fernando

Lew · 30th September 2007, 09:53 PM

Tim

Very nice! I must make a trip across the pond one day so you can take me to one of your swap meets

Lew

Jim McDougall · 1st October 2007, 04:39 AM

Luc,
Nicely put detail on these! and you seem to have some excellent resources on African weapons, thank you for sharing the information ! African weapons are intriguing but most of the resources are difficult to come by and in many cases in other languages (although captioned and summarized in English in many cases). While much of the material on African weapons makes cursory examinations of the typology, discussion on development and possible influences found in the weapons seems carefully avoided.

Best regards,
Jim

Tim Simmons · 1st October 2007, 09:47 AM

I not trying to suggest I know more than Peter Westerdijk. Ideas do change?
I wonder if this is more a relation to this type of artifact. I have to say it is more comfortable in the hand this way, not seeing the curve as a blade which incidentally is not sharp.

katana · 1st October 2007, 03:35 PM

Interesting 'form' Tim,
......with such a top heavy design and the blunt curved edge suggests that, if a weapon, is more like a 'flattened' mace or more accurately a 'war hammer' (especially with that 'spike')
Like Fernando I had assumed the curved edge would be sharp, had it been so...I do not think this would be a very good 'bush knife'.....a machete or the many forms that exist... Bolo's etc are 'top heavy' but have a longer blade and would be easier to control when cutting vegetation.

Luc LEFEBVRE · 1st October 2007, 11:05 PM

To be complete, the page from the Westerdijk book, and the knive I have from this style province.
Luc

fernando · 2nd October 2007, 08:21 PM

Let me post some nonsense.Tolerance from the experts needed here.
Having a look at Waffen aus Zentral-Africa CD (courtesy of Freddy d'Hont), and to what else one can read out there, this piece is definately a throwing knife, or its pattern was borne for such purpose. Used by the ethnic groups Margi or Makatam, is called a Mberembere. The reason for its round edge not being sharp must be due to the fact that these things ceased their field action and became ceremonial adornments. I tryed to read some of the german text in Waffen aus Zentral-Africa with a translation motor, but the results are not so famous. Howver and amazingly i got it that these ( or other ) throwing knives had quite a serious performance, like being possible to be thrown to 100 mts. distance, half of it with accuracy. Thrown at 20 meters they could open ( no better term ) a man. So much for those who tell that throwing knives were made to be symbolic.

1st October 2007, 09:47 AM	#4
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,842	Look at it this way I not trying to suggest I know more than Peter Westerdijk. Ideas do change? I wonder if this is more a relation to this type of artifact. I have to say it is more comfortable in the hand this way, not seeing the curve as a blade which incidentally is not sharp.

1st October 2007, 11:05 PM	#6
Luc LEFEBVRE Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: France Posts: 473	To be complete, the page from the Westerdijk book, and the knive I have from this style province. Luc Attached Images

30th September 2007, 09:47 PM	#1
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Hi Tim What a most interesting piece. It doesn't look so modern ... how old could it be ? What is the handle material? One more question. Which is the sharpened section, the round outer part only ? Thanks and regards fernando

30th September 2007, 09:53 PM	#2
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Tim Very nice! I must make a trip across the pond one day so you can take me to one of your swap meets Lew

1st October 2007, 04:39 AM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,190	Luc, Nicely put detail on these! and you seem to have some excellent resources on African weapons, thank you for sharing the information ! African weapons are intriguing but most of the resources are difficult to come by and in many cases in other languages (although captioned and summarized in English in many cases). While much of the material on African weapons makes cursory examinations of the typology, discussion on development and possible influences found in the weapons seems carefully avoided. Best regards, Jim

1st October 2007, 03:35 PM	#5
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Interesting 'form' Tim, ......with such a top heavy design and the blunt curved edge suggests that, if a weapon, is more like a 'flattened' mace or more accurately a 'war hammer' (especially with that 'spike') Like Fernando I had assumed the curved edge would be sharp, had it been so...I do not think this would be a very good 'bush knife'.....a machete or the many forms that exist... Bolo's etc are 'top heavy' but have a longer blade and would be easier to control when cutting vegetation.

2nd October 2007, 08:21 PM	#7
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Let me post some nonsense.Tolerance from the experts needed here. Having a look at Waffen aus Zentral-Africa CD (courtesy of Freddy d'Hont), and to what else one can read out there, this piece is definately a throwing knife, or its pattern was borne for such purpose. Used by the ethnic groups Margi or Makatam, is called a Mberembere. The reason for its round edge not being sharp must be due to the fact that these things ceased their field action and became ceremonial adornments. I tryed to read some of the german text in Waffen aus Zentral-Africa with a translation motor, but the results are not so famous. Howver and amazingly i got it that these ( or other ) throwing knives had quite a serious performance, like being possible to be thrown to 100 mts. distance, half of it with accuracy. Thrown at 20 meters they could open ( no better term ) a man. So much for those who tell that throwing knives were made to be symbolic.