Help Identifying a sword

[Alan62]

Originally Posted by Paul Digard

Alan - lovely sword, but a steel hilt rather than silver surely?

Paul

Paul ,Thank You. It was tagged as a "silver hilted sword" . In the pics there are areas that look like a discoloration or brownish. These areas are not rust and only appear in the photos,perhaps a reflection. I really do not know for sure if it is silver or for that matter even what it means when they refer to a sword as "silver hilted" or silver mounted.I have some examples of them in my books but they only reference the makers or the era and not what exactly these terms mean.
Perhaps you or Jim can shed some light on it for me.

Paging Jim McDougall

[Paul Digard]

Alan - to me 'silver hilted' means just that. Pommel, guard etc in silver. I have seen silver-hilted spadroons but I'd be amazed if yours was - not just from the colour (and here I'm referring to the shade of the polished areas) but the pitting visible on the close-up shots of the hilt. Silver goes black and wears smoothly from polishing, I've never seen it pit like iron does. I expect the triple stranded wire wrap over the copper on that beautifully wrapped grip is silver but nothing else.

Still a fine late C18 military officer's sword though. How long is the blade and are there any markings on it?

Paul

[Alan62]

Thanks Paul
I thought they may just be casting flaws where polishing cannot reach, but they are probably just pits I am still very happy with the purchase and look forward to more detailed information on this sword.
Its blade is 30.25 inches long with a 29.25 inch fuller that runs all the way to the tip of the blade.The blade is .75 inch at the ricasso and a little over 3/16ths on the spine at the hilt.
There are no visible makers marks
Thanks again

[Jim McDougall]

Hi Alan,
Beautiful patination on this one!!
As noted, I believe this to be a British officers short sabre of 18th c. and a remarkably similar iron hilt to your example is shown in "Swords and Blades of the American Revolution" (George C. Neumann, Stackpole, 1973, p.106, #134.S). This example of these 'four slot' hilts has the same pommel/capstan and gadrooned grip. These apparantly were favored by both British and American officers. It should be remembered that in this period, c.1775-1780, individuals all were essentially considered British.
The straight blade on yours is straight, and similar to those seen on similar 'short sabres' c.1760 (Neumann, op.cit. #133.5). In this period through the 1790's some straight bladed swords were termed sabres, and the term 'spadroon' was also applied. I think Paul can probably better elaborate on the application of these terms as his knowledge on military swords of this period is well known.

I find the striations at the front of the guard most interesting, as they may represent influences other than simply aesthetic decoration, and it would be interesting to seek others opinions. These may be stylized marks recalling the scallop shell guards of earlier English hangers, or possibly even similar striations seen on Spanish shellguard weapons of this period. From a more esoteric perspective, it should be noted that there are distinct possibilities of Masonic associations and symbolism, and naturally in these times, both Colonial and British officers, typically as gentry, often had such Masonic affiliation. Any ideas guys?

All best regards,
Jim

[Alan62]

Thank You again Jim for your very detailed and for a lack of a better term
!Awsome! explaination and assesment of this sword.

Did you see the briquette style sword from a few posts back and is there any chance you might have info on the makers mark FC

Thank You again so much

[Jim McDougall]

Hi Alan,
You bet! Absolutely my pleasure, and I appreciate very much the opportunity to see these great weapons you keep finding!
The briquet is as you note, a most serviceable sidearm, which is probably why it was copied so consistantly by nearly every European army at the turn of the century c.1800. I have one that I have owned for over 40 years! one of my very first swords, and it has a cast cartouche in the hilt at the center of the crossguard with initials PS. I researched for many years, but never found any satisfactory possibility.
Always convinced that it was British, in later years I discovered that it may possibly be Spanish, and the wedge shaped heavily patinated blade seems consistant with Spanish colonial weapons I have seen of this period. It seems I moved on to other projects as this one seemed so inconclusive, especially with the incredibly broad diffusion of this form. There was however, a bizarre Spanish colonial hybrid with the 'Spanish motto' blade (see the thread with Matt Branch's sword) mounted with an altered briquet hilt, and loosely mounted three bar cavalry hilt of c.1820's. On the frontier in Mexico in the 19th c. and nearly unto to 20th c. there seem to be numerous extremely crudely done 'blacksmith' hybrids, and I mention this one only because of the briquet hilt component.
Unusual to see one with a scabbard! What is the blade length, details?
All best regards,
JIm

[Alan62]

The blade is 23 inches long from the tip to the center of the ricasso nearest the hilt as the blade is slightly curved, it is 1 and 3/8 wide at the ricasso and the spine is 3/8s of an inch thick at the ricasso. I believe the scabbard to be original to the sword.As deep as I can see on the inside of it, shows signs of age .I looked at many reproduction scabbards and never found one made quite like this one.But you never know.
Like I said in the previous post about this one,I would probably pick it up first if someone strange came walking into my house or I were off to battle.It is a very stout little weapon

Thanks again for all the info

That is if I didn't pick up this stout little guy first....
....for your viewing pleasure, just cause I figure you can appreciate it


Its a Colt 44 M1860 Army with factory Richardson conversion It belonged to my Greatgrandfather ,So I guess that makes it a Texan or Tex-nographic weapon

Sorry I got a little carried away