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Old 10th January 2007, 01:17 AM   #1
Jim McDougall
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I agree with David, perhaps the term 'occult' would be a much better 'working description' for studying these daggers employed ceremonially by certain groups, referring to the athame of course.
In the case of Spiral's dagger, I am inclined to agree that it is most likely a 19th century theme dagger that reflects the same literary inspiration seen in the early Swiss daggers referenced in my earlier post. The Victorian period is well known for heightened romanticism of this nature and the popularization of 'Gothic literature' . On that note, I very much like the literary detection done by Katana! I am quite convinced that Yannis' observation of the depiction of Esmeralda on this dagger is correct and extremely astute!

I also think that this thread has become extremely interesting, especially since much of the ritual and ceremonial use of the 'athame' corresponds with the metaphysical aspects of certain weapons of this type in numerous cultures, with the Tibetan 'phurbu' as an example. In this sense I think these daggers, despite somewhat sinister associations as interpreted may well be considered worthy of discussion in ethnographic perspective. I also think that the impressive posts that everyone has placed on this thread reveals the comprehensive knowledge of the membership here on even the most esoteric topics and begs to differ with the question of whether this dagger should have been posted on an ethnographic forum....and I am very glad that Spiral did post it here!
Excellent thread guys!!

All best regards,
Jim
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Old 10th January 2007, 10:30 AM   #2
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Since I wrote the “Huchback” opinion, there are 3 more evidences to agree with it.
1. The knife in the belt, as Katana wrote
2. The item she holds is a tambourine. Please notice the circles.
3. I asked about the dress code of this woman and they told me that only the lower part of society (like a gipsy) would dress like this on the streets of central Europe in early 19th century. Even Disney studios knows that.

Also, the half man half goat figure is Pan, the ancient Greek god of shepherds and their flocks. He became “satanic” symbol when Christians took the political power. His sins were he enjoyed music, dance and making love in the woods. 2000 years later these are still crimes for some minds.
BTW the word “panic” comes from his name because he could inspire fear if he wished so. So he was a great ally for warriors. Athenians believed that with his help won the Marathon battle when Persians lost their guts.
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