Keris found in Denmark

[VVV]

I just updated my collection pages with 5 Keris I found when in Denmark earlier this Fall.
The first 3 actually were found in a seller's junkbox.
All comments appreciated.

Keris Terengganu Pipit Teleng

http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_album.php

Keris Bugis Sampir Penghulu (Sumatran or Malaysian?)

http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_album.php

Keris Sajen Luk

http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_album.php

Keris Bali with painted sheath and unusual hilt.

http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_album.php

Kalis Taluseko Sulu with Javanese resembling sheath

http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_album.php

I hope the Kampungnet database doesn't go down again like yesterday...

Michael

[David]

Well i guess Denmark isn't all that strange a place to come across these. Mads Lange was probably the most famous Dane who lived and traded in Indonesia (mostly in Bali) and he left quite a legacy behind him.
These all look very interesting Michael. I hope to have a more detailed look later. Thanks for showing.
BTW, feel free to upload more photos onto this site. That way we won't have to worry whether Kampungnet is up or not and we will also have these images in our data base as well.

[Flavio]

Hi Michael, all these pieces are beautiful, but the kalis is very elegant!!! Congratulations dear friend

[VVV]

Thanks David and Flavio,

Yes Mads Lange was one of the first but several other Danes also visited the Archipelago.
When you see how many pictures I have on Kampungnet maybe you agree it's better to only upload a sample of each on the forum for those interested?

Look forward to your comments and corrections.

Michael

[David]

Oh, Michael, i wasn't suggesting you upload ALL of them.
Just a few of each, maybe an overall of the blade and a detail for instance.
I also agree that the Kalis is beautiful. Given it's greneng pattern and the very Indonesian sheath i wonder about the Sulu attribution.

[Ian]

Michael:

That Kalis Sulu is beautiful. The ivory kakatua is considerably smaller than most. Do you have any idea where this one originated? I'm wondering if it came from Brunei or Malaysia because it is somewhat atypical for a traditional Moro kris.

Lovely pieces all.

Ian.

[VVV]

Thanks Ian,

I suspect that it maybe could come from NW Borneo based on the motifs on the silver band. But that's just a guess and I still think it's Sulu.
Please convince me if that's not the case?

David,

Here are some additional blade pictures. They are in the same order as above. In case you want to watch them "the proper way" please go to Kampungnet or turn them in your viewer.

Michael

PS Something strange happened when uploading?
The order is now Sajen, Bugis, Terengganu, Bali and Sulu(?).

[Flavio]

Well, also the bali is wonderful!!!

[Ian]

I suspect that it maybe could come from NW Borneo based on the motifs on the silver band. But that's just a guess and I still think it's Sulu.
Please convince me if that's not the case?

Hi Michael:

The reason that I think it is odd for Sulu (that is, Moro) is the hilt: a smaller than average kakatua and the continuous silver wrap to the hilt which has an octagonal "tubular" apeparance. The usual form of Moro silver hilt dress would be circular or oval bands of silver that overlap. Also, there is a small "lip" to the silver handle sheath just above the gangya -- not commonlty seen on Moro weapons.

That said, there was a lot of interaction between the Sulu and Brunei Sultanates, so some diffusion of styles each way probably occurred. Indeed "Sulu" has sometimes been used to include Brunei, so we may be splitting hairs.

None of which alters the fact that it is a lovely kris.

Ian.

[VVV]

Hi Ian,

Thanks for your explanation.
I also find what you exemplify quite odd.
There is one Kris in Leiden, collected in Sulu, that looks like it has just as small pommel as mine.
It also looks like as if the hilt on the Kris "Andus" in E Banks article The Keris Sulok or Sundang, has an octagonal hilt (really dark pictures in that old article so hard to see for sure)?
And then I have this Kris in my collection, that I also thought was Sulu?

http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_album.php

Maybe they are related?

On the lip I haven't found any other example yet with that feature?

Michael

PS Flavio, what's wrong with Bugis Keris?

[Flavio]

Originally Posted by VVV

PS Flavio, what's wrong with Bugis Keris?

Hi Michael, nothing at all (my only keris is a bugis )! Anyway beautiful kris

[Ian]

Thanks Michael.

What I meant to say is that an octagonal hilt, per se, is not rare on Moro kris, but a continuous silver "sleeve" as shown in your first example above is something that I have not seen before. Perhaps I have just not seen enough high end beauties like these.

Your second example looks more traditional and appears to be a Mindanao kris, most likely Maranao -- the "elephant trunk" area is of the Maranao form (according to Cato). The octagonal handle is wrapped with silver wire to conform to the underlying shape of the handle, although the small band holding the baca baca is circular. The ivory kakatua is small but of traditional shape -- probably late 19th or early 20th C. but could be earlier. The scabbard fits with a Mindanao kris of around that period also. So this one looks a typical Moro kris all round, perhaps redressed around 1900 +/-. The blade looks considerably older than the hilt and scabbard.

The one at the top of the post still has me baffled as to where it originated.

Regards,

Ian.

[VVV]

Thanks Ian,

I obviously misunderstood your first comment.

On the second Kris I also classified it as a Maranao blade at first according to Cato.
At that time I decided to try to better figure out the Cato classification method and sent pictures as well as my classifications of my Kris to a more experienced member on this before publishing them on the Internet.
And that's why it was changed to Sulu on both blade and scabbard for this Kris.
This was some time ago and I don't remember why he insisted it was Sulu?
I will e-mail him about it again.
Probably it's time for me to revise my Moro Kris classifications?
Thanks for bringing this up.

Michael

[VVV]

Ian,

I haven't recieved any response from my original source.
So I will change it on my collection pages to your classification based on Cato. Thanks again for bringing this up.

No more comments on the Indonesian Keris???

Michael

[VVV]

Originally Posted by Ian

Michael:

That Kalis Sulu is beautiful. The ivory kakatua is considerably smaller than most. Do you have any idea where this one originated? I'm wondering if it came from Brunei or Malaysia because it is somewhat atypical for a traditional Moro kris.

Lovely pieces all.

Ian.

Ian,

I have been doing some research on this Kris but no success so far.
Maybe it is from Malaysia as you suggest?
I found this illustration (blew up the relevant part of it) of Sultan Abdullah and chiefs of Perak from 1878.

Michael