Tachi versus katana in horseback fighting

[Montino Bourbon]

and especially a war-trained rider can control his horse with his legs. Certainly I never had trouble controlling MY horse with my legs in battle. I would consider a horse that was not thus trained useless for combat.

Imagine a man using sword and shield; how do you think that he controlled his horse; with a third hand?

A samurai drawing a bow would be in the same position. Thus, the use of a sword with both hands would be quite possible!

[Chris Evans]

Hi Montino,

Originally Posted by Montino Bourbon

A samurai drawing a bow would be in the same position. Thus, the use of a sword with both hands would be quite possible!

Absolutely true.

And yet at the same time we are told by no less than Musashi that it is not the way to go - Why? He tells us that because it is encumbering. Nor did any modern and evolved cavalry that I am aware of advocate a two handed sword, though all their military raiding schools tried to instill in their raiders the ability to control a horse without hands.

Probably the small Mongol pony that constituted the original blood-stock of the Japanese was an easier horse to control, especially by a diminutive Japanese raider. The Mongol archers for this very reason are said to have preferred mares, whereas the Euros had a liking for much larger horses, stallions which were more aggressive but harder to control. It would be interesting to find out if the Japanese also preferred mares. Of course, through endless warring, Euro cavalry came to understand by the middle ages the shock value of massed cavalry formations and the advantages of large and fearless war horses....

It is a well known fact amongst cavalry man that being dumped from a spooked horse, even when holding the reins, is a real probability. And many of the best light cavalry chose men of smaller stature so as not to tire out the horse too easily. A small man on a large horse in the middle of a battle does not add up to all that much control.

Cheers
Chris

[tsubame1]

Originally Posted by Chris Evans

(quoting Montino)

And yet at the same time we are told by no less than Musashi that it is not the way to go - Why? He tells us that because it is encumbering. Nor did any modern and evolved cavalry that I am aware of advocate a two handed sword, though all their military raiding schools tried to instill in their raiders the ability to control a horse without hands.

Musashi is very renowned for his skillfullness by martial artists but he was a painter, a writer, a poet too. His scripts and figure are highly misinterpreted by western non-specialized people.
Go-Rin-no-Sho, Hagakure, Kojiki, NihonShoki, in so many years I've found almost all the japanese literature used to sustain a misconception of some sort. Samurai didn't use a sword with both hands from horseback. Period.
The lenght of the nakago is misleading here. A tang lenght has purpose of balance and armony too. Most of the curvature of many Tachi was in the tang, for example. I can' say that in the heat of a fight once on a while Tachi could have been used with both hands in very close combat between two mounted Samurai. I say that this is so hard and unlikely that such exceptions shouldn't be take in account in a scholar discussion, if we want to consider this disussion of any scholar usefulness.
There are pictures in which a Samurai cuts a rain of arrows remaining safe.
There is a Koryu that teaches the cutting of a *single* arrow fired to
the swordman. Does this mean that is possible to use the Tachi/Katana as a shield against a rain of arrows in the heat of a Sengoku battlefield ? NO, it's impossible. Phisically impossible. The same way it's impossible to sustain that
Tachi was designed to be used with both hands from horseback.
Striking to left is, per sè, a difficult task already with a sigle (right) hand only,
go figure with two together. Striking to right means to shorten the reach of the arm/blade at about half the possible with a single hand/arm. This without any gain in power in both cases. On the contrary the left arm would slow the action of the right one. IMHO is this what Musashi meant in saying that to hold a sword with both hands by horse is "encumbering". The others are your assuptions from this statement, and worth for what they are, assumptions.
I attach a couple pictures of historical correct use of Tachi from horseback.
I'm asking Samurai Archives for more ancient ones and I reserve the right to add them later. if you want better and more insightful feedback about the matter by english-born experts feel free to move the discussion here :
http://forums.samurai-archives.com/index.php
I'll be glad to open one if you want. You need to register, but it's not neccessary to give a real name.