Baskethilt Dagger for ID and discussion

SwordLover79 · Yesterday, 05:58 PM

Gentlemen: its been quite a while since I posted, but I have been enjoying the forum discussions as usual. Here a dagger that I acquired last year. The 13.25 inch blade is 1 inch wide with a central ridge running the length on both sides. The copper mesh wrapped grip is 3 1/4 inches capped with a 1 3/4 inch steel pommel. The quillons are 8 inches wide. No markings on the hilt or blade that I can see. I would love to learn something about the country and timeframe that this dagger was made. All comments and insights most welcome...Thanks!

kronckew · Today, 05:57 AM

Looks like a variant of a main gauche - left hand parrying dagger, almost a sail-guard, but skeletal, with extra large perforations.

Triarii · Today, 03:51 PM

The late C16th in England / Scotland saw the evolution of basket hilted or 'ale house daggers'. There are way more descriptions than survivors. There was one in York Museum (UK).

John Smythe mentions them in 1590 - 'great brauling Alehouse hilts', as do others, and they seem to be the same as 'bum daggers' (which are noted as having iron hilts), due to being worn across the waist/backside and are probably the same thing as 'close hilted' daggers. Close-hilted being used to describe basket hilted swords. Some accounts desribe the daggers as weighting 2-3lbs and the hilts as being handy to flatten peoples noses, so they were beefy things. Di Grassi has a print showing one in use versus a sword.

Whether this is one from that era I don't know, but it's a line of enquiry. The blade type with the distinct spine looks right. There were some mid C16th English royal proclamations limiting blades on daggers to 12" (which was probably ignored as much as the proscriptions on rapier blade length were), so 13" is in the right ballpark.

Yesterday, 05:58 PM	#1
SwordLover79 Member Join Date: Jun 2022 Location: San Diego Posts: 57	Baskethilt Dagger for ID and discussion Gentlemen: its been quite a while since I posted, but I have been enjoying the forum discussions as usual. Here a dagger that I acquired last year. The 13.25 inch blade is 1 inch wide with a central ridge running the length on both sides. The copper mesh wrapped grip is 3 1/4 inches capped with a 1 3/4 inch steel pommel. The quillons are 8 inches wide. No markings on the hilt or blade that I can see. I would love to learn something about the country and timeframe that this dagger was made. All comments and insights most welcome...Thanks! Attached Images

Today, 05:57 AM	#2
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,229	Looks like a variant of a main gauche - left hand parrying dagger, almost a sail-guard, but skeletal, with extra large perforations. Attached Images

Today, 03:51 PM	#3
Triarii Member Join Date: Oct 2021 Location: Bristol Posts: 126	The late C16th in England / Scotland saw the evolution of basket hilted or 'ale house daggers'. There are way more descriptions than survivors. There was one in York Museum (UK). John Smythe mentions them in 1590 - 'great brauling Alehouse hilts', as do others, and they seem to be the same as 'bum daggers' (which are noted as having iron hilts), due to being worn across the waist/backside and are probably the same thing as 'close hilted' daggers. Close-hilted being used to describe basket hilted swords. Some accounts desribe the daggers as weighting 2-3lbs and the hilts as being handy to flatten peoples noses, so they were beefy things. Di Grassi has a print showing one in use versus a sword. Whether this is one from that era I don't know, but it's a line of enquiry. The blade type with the distinct spine looks right. There were some mid C16th English royal proclamations limiting blades on daggers to 12" (which was probably ignored as much as the proscriptions on rapier blade length were), so 13" is in the right ballpark.