Bali Keris

Gustav · 30th March 2025, 11:08 AM

Alan, just sow your expanded post.
Yes exactly. And the Kecak being an invention of 30ties, and Barong dance in the form as it existed in the 30ties being likely not much older then around 1850.

A. G. Maisey · 30th March 2025, 01:13 PM

I have not read this book of Hildred Geertz', Gustav, it is perhaps something that might interest me, but to be honest, I find that amongst academics who do publish on Bali, there can be quite wide variation in opinions. This, I personally feel is something to be expected, especially where pre-colonial Bali is concerned.

My own knowledge & experience of Bali comes mostly from people, ordinary working people who might be of any caste or clan and craftsmen and priests.

In fact back in the 1980's through to the mid-1990's I spent quite a lot of time in a Brahmin household --- distant relative --- but that gentleman has now moved into a different world.

I do not disdain writings on Bali, & I have read more than a little of the published material, but when I try comparing information gained from reading, with the understandings & beliefs of people who are in positions where their knowledge could be expected to reflect accuracy, I do find that the variations make it more than difficult for me to form any sort of all encompassing opinion in respect of many things.

For example, the understandings that you have of the use of gold & figural hilts. My own understandings vary somewhat from what your understandings appear to be.

I'm not going to get into a ping-pong match about this, there is simply no point in it.

You have your own experience, & I have mine, I have no desire at all to try to change your understandings.

HughChen · 31st March 2025, 03:35 PM

I have two very similar silver hilts. They are of the same type of the two you shows here.

David · 31st March 2025, 07:23 PM

Thanks for you comments here Alan. They confirm some previous suspicions i had from when i saw this keris elsewhere.

Gustav · 1st April 2025, 09:01 AM

Yes, there always is more then one truth.

A. G. Maisey · 1st April 2025, 09:34 PM

Then we have Samuel Arbesman.

A good friend sent me this, this morning, pretty appropriate for keris related matters, I think.

Gustav · 1st April 2025, 09:52 PM

Exactly.

Sajen · 2nd April 2025, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Then we have Samuel Arbesman.

A good friend sent me this, this morning, pretty appropriate for keris related matters, I think.

Jep!

31st March 2025, 03:35 PM	#3
HughChen Member Join Date: Aug 2024 Location: China Posts: 161	Two similar silver hilt I have two very similar silver hilts. They are of the same type of the two you shows here. Attached Images

1st April 2025, 09:34 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Then we have Samuel Arbesman. A good friend sent me this, this morning, pretty appropriate for keris related matters, I think. Attached Images

30th March 2025, 11:08 AM	#1
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,280	Alan, just sow your expanded post. Yes exactly. And the Kecak being an invention of 30ties, and Barong dance in the form as it existed in the 30ties being likely not much older then around 1850.

30th March 2025, 01:13 PM	#2
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	I have not read this book of Hildred Geertz', Gustav, it is perhaps something that might interest me, but to be honest, I find that amongst academics who do publish on Bali, there can be quite wide variation in opinions. This, I personally feel is something to be expected, especially where pre-colonial Bali is concerned. My own knowledge & experience of Bali comes mostly from people, ordinary working people who might be of any caste or clan and craftsmen and priests. In fact back in the 1980's through to the mid-1990's I spent quite a lot of time in a Brahmin household --- distant relative --- but that gentleman has now moved into a different world. I do not disdain writings on Bali, & I have read more than a little of the published material, but when I try comparing information gained from reading, with the understandings & beliefs of people who are in positions where their knowledge could be expected to reflect accuracy, I do find that the variations make it more than difficult for me to form any sort of all encompassing opinion in respect of many things. For example, the understandings that you have of the use of gold & figural hilts. My own understandings vary somewhat from what your understandings appear to be. I'm not going to get into a ping-pong match about this, there is simply no point in it. You have your own experience, & I have mine, I have no desire at all to try to change your understandings.

31st March 2025, 07:23 PM	#4
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,218	Thanks for you comments here Alan. They confirm some previous suspicions i had from when i saw this keris elsewhere.

1st April 2025, 09:01 AM	#5
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,280	Yes, there always is more then one truth.

1st April 2025, 09:52 PM	#7
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,280	Exactly.