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#1 |
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Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Canada
Posts: 259
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I am also quite interested in these, I actually watched 2 auctions end today within my modest price range and I really wanted one, I will come back with the photos as I am curious to find out if they were old. I think one of these will be my next acquisition.. when I can afford it..
I am quite interested in a symbol I have seen on the scabbard and on the blades that I think looks like a closed eye. |
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#2 |
Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
Posts: 10,189
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Thank you very much guys,
Kai, here are more pics. I do not have the sword at hand, and it unfortunately does not have the scabbard. I am really curious on that odd fixture off the blade. The inscribing is also curious, it seems deeply applied but not like usual style, more carved. There are spots in the hilt where something round is missing...what would have been there? |
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#3 |
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Join Date: Sep 2021
Location: Leiden, NL
Posts: 553
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Albert van Zonneveld's "Traditional Weapons of Borneo: The Attire of the Headhunters Part III: Swords & Knives" has a lot of information about mandau swords. Might be a good reference to check out (and I know he posts on this forum sometimes).
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#4 |
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Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Canada
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I would like to preface this by saying I know very little about the subject
This photo I put together is based on my first impressions. looking into the Borneo clamp ant, it can jump at prey, fling itself backwards with jaws, and decapitate, aswell as lock down... some ants in Borneo even explode... |
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#5 |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,255
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Hello Joe,
Yes, ants are really fascinating critters as long as they are not biting and/or stinging us. Some feel downright nasty if one is on the receiving end of their weapons... The clamp ant profile really resembles this krowit motif, indeed. Often the prongs turn inwards though which would fit less. BTW, it is also utilized to close wounds if I recall correctly! Dayak symbolism is a really vast subject (considering the many ethnic groups and their culture & histories): Some motifs are straightforward (heads) or pretty obvious (aso, leeches). Others, however, can be highly stylized and really tough to identify, especially among a background of confluent motifs; there is a considerable body of published work (of widely differing qualities & scopes) with probably still way more gaps than corroborated knowledge. We had requests regarding such topics about a year ago and I'd suggest to start separate threads for discussing specific motifs. Maybe this also helps to bring in more of the specialized Borneo crowd. Regards, Kai Last edited by kai; 4th February 2023 at 04:35 PM. |
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#6 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
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Just to warn the international audience: The book is written in Dutch; an automatic English translation is available on request though. Regards, Kai |
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#7 | |||
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Join Date: Apr 2005
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Thanks, Jim!
I'd lean towards identifying it as a tilan(g) kamarau from the Iban. These often have more slender blades but also other blade shapes are known. The engraving does seem to be Iban; also hilts with unusual carvings are not rare with this not very homogenous group (with widely distributed sub-groups). In Albert's book referenced above, there is a piece with somewhat similar blade shown on page 84. It is identified as jimpul; I believe it fits better with the tilan(g) kamarau though. Iban swords can be pretty varied and often present a mix of features; some may be historical intermediates. However, in most cases I'd assume these to be just variants that defy simple classification. Let's just celebrate the creativity and diversity without spending too much time on pigeon-holing! There is another group of swords with symmetrically sharpened edge from northern Borneo. You can find examples by searching for gayang on this forum; it's not relevant for your piece IMHO. Quote:
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Regards, Kai |
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#8 |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
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Forgot to mention, Jim: IMHO an authentic, old piece made for use in the culture. Only the light rattan braiding seems to be a later fix for a now missing resin "ferrule" as usually seen in mandau/etc.
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#9 |
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Location: Canada
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I hope you don't mind that I share it here, but I had another thought..
I have seen ants go to war, and I have seen them build mega cities, I have seen them take down much bigger predators like lizards, snakes, tarantula etc.. but there is one animal that eats 20,000 ants a day, and is pretty invulnerable.. Last edited by JoeCanada42; 3rd February 2023 at 09:59 PM. |
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#10 |
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Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Canada
Posts: 259
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sorry cant help it made another...
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#11 |
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Location: Canada
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...
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#12 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,255
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Pangolins rate high in local lore, indeed. Not easy to ascertain whether any putative associations vibe with traditional understanding as found in the originating culture. Regards, Kai |
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#13 |
Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
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Kai, thank you so much for all this detailed information and the encouraging comment on its being authentic. I have had this for so long I had forgotten about it, years ago when I was trying to get an understanding of the forms on these regions. I ended up in other fields, and had forgotten how fascinating these areas are.
One of the most confusing matters seems to be the terminology, which is understandable as there are so many languages and dialects involved. I am presuming the Iban (Sea Dayaks)were situated in North/West Borneo and into Malaysia. I think your suggestion for separate threads for some of these specifics makes sense, as the complexity of each is enough to warrant singular attention. I have never followed the difference...mandau....parang ihlang?? Now tilang kamarau? Thank you again Kai, your knowledge is remarkable and your comments very much appreciated. Best regards, Jim |
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