TAUSUG BARUNG

[Sajen]

A picture from the light lamination and the handle today.

[Sajen]

PS: I wouldn't remove the yellow plastic band, see this kris from the collection of Mario Ghiringhelli. See the picture taken from the pictured book.
It's a part of it's history IMVHO.

[xasterix]

Originally Posted by Sajen

PS: I wouldn't remove the yellow plastic band, see this kris from the collection of Mario Ghiringhelli. See the picture taken from the pictured book.
It's a part of it's history IMVHO.

The farthest I would go would be 70s though. I've held several locally-obtained pieces similar to the thread-starter's, provenanced from mid-70s all the way up to late 80s, hence my position on this. I chose the 80s as a conservative estimate. I'm OK to be proven wrong, if there's a provenanced WW2 / immediate postwar piece that would match the thread-starter's, with a definite date of acquisition.

As for the carving on the pommel, that same carving style exists until today, among newly-made barungs in Sulu. I have friends who make those.

[Sajen]

Hi Xas,

I am nearly sure that Yves will clean, polish and etch the blade, we will see, if it's from laminated steel the age will go rather in my estimation, when not more in the direction of your estimation.
Otherwise, I own much older pieces where the blade isn't laminated.
I go mainly with the overall patination with the later (60s-70s) addition of the yellow plastic band.
But you describe the problem well, since the 1940s the style until today doesn't change much.
PS: The horn plates at the scabbards are in the most cases from buffalo horn instead of turtel shell.

Regards,
Detlef

[xasterix]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Hi Xas,

I am nearly sure that Yves will clean, polish and etch the blade, we will see, if it's from laminated steel the age will go rather in my estimation, when not more in the direction of your estimation.
Otherwise, I own much older pieces where the blade isn't laminated.
I go mainly with the overall patination with the later (60s-70s) addition of the yellow plastic band.
But you describe the problem well, since the 1940s the style until today doesn't change much.
PS: The horn plates at the scabbards are in the most cases from buffalo horn instead of turtel shell.

Regards,
Detlef

HI Detlef, you're right on the point that presence or absence of lamination will be unreliable - I've been told there were still laminated Sulu blades being made until the 90s, and there are pre1900s that are monosteel, as you confirmed.

Anyway whichever way it goes, I'm sure that's a reliable fighting blade, as barungs always are. Hoping the thread starter is able to restore it back to its full glory.

[David]

I would say that it is impossible to tell from the current condition of this blade whether or not it is laminated. It would need to be polished and then etched to find out. So i personally will draw no conclusions there.
On the yellow plastic wrap, i would still say it would be nice to replace this with rattan. Yes, Vanna has a kris with pink tape wrapped around the sheath. But just because these materials are indeed being used in more modern times by actual indigenous users of these weapons i am not convinced that is a good excuse to preserve the plastic wrap. The plastic isn't in the best of shape anyway, so if you are restoring it should be replaced and it is just as easy and will look far better if you replace it with rattan. Either way, the black electrical tape has to go.
I do agree with Detlef that there is both older monosteel blades as well as newer laminated blades. So i am not convinced that can be used to verify the age of the blade. I think this is certainly post WWII, but how much later than that date is difficult to tell.

[Ian]

The decoration of Moro barung and kris scabbards with exotic synthetic materials (including aluminum) is very much a phenomenon of WWII and later, and seldom seen earlier. I agree with Xas that the wrap on the scabbard of Yves' barung is most likely 1980s in manufacture. Similarly, the kakatua pommel is post-WWII, and especially used later in the 20th C until today. Sajen's example has a kakatua with a smaller crest. This style may have appeared shortly before WWII and predates Yves' example.

I can't tell if the blade is laminated and it probably does not matter a whole lot for reasons already discussed. If the dress on the hilt and scabbard are original, then the dates Xas has given are what I would estimate also, making this barung roughly 30–50 years old. It is possible that the blade may be older and was redressed in the late 20th C, but that would be hard to demonstrate.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Ian

Sajen's example has a kakatua with a smaller crest. This style may have appeared shortly before WWII and predates Yves' example.

Hi Ian,

I think it's the other way around, Xas's example is earlier.

Regards,
Detlef

[xasterix]

Originally Posted by Sajen

A picture from the light lamination and the handle today.

Hi Detlef, this sample of yours reminds me of my own barung, a double-edged from Zamboanga estimated to be WW2 era (immediately before, during, or after WW2). The small-featured pommel is typical of that era, and is markedly different from the thread-starter's. It's monosteel.

Ian, thanks for your insights.

[Ian]

Hi Xas,

Yes, the hilt on yours is very similar to Detlef's example. Immediately pre-WWII or WWII era would be my estimate. Nasty looking double edge befitting the time of conflict. I would think its owner favored stabbing, although I'm sure that back edge could be used for slashing too.

Ian

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by xasterix

Hi Detlef, this sample of yours reminds me of my own barung, a double-edged from Zamboanga estimated to be WW2 era (immediately before, during, or after WW2). The small-featured pommel is typical of that era, and is markedly different from the thread-starter's. It's monosteel.

Hi Xas,

Yes, you are correct, they are very similar and I agree with you about the both carvings at barung handles, the ones from our examples are a few decades earlier. Still have the feeling, judging by the patination, that Yves's example is a little bit older than the 1980s. Just my feelings.
BTW, a very nice and unusual example.

Regards,
Detlef