Smallsword Duelling

[Chris Evans]

Originally Posted by urbanspaceman

Firstly, I must apologise for my statement about the number of colichemardes in Greenwich being the greatest number: Royal Armouries at Leeds have over a dozen.

In regard to the source of the name: I've read several dissertations regarding this business and am firmly convinced there was no relationship. However, if anyone has evidence to the contrary it would be of great interest to the smallsword cognoscenti.
Here is a link to a paper written recently that covers every aspect of the colichemarde in a detail that defies condensing:
http://eprints.hud.ac.uk/id/eprint/34663/

I have also posted an image of a Dutch smallsword/duelling rapier from the second half of the 1600s in the hope that someone can confirm its purpose: was it a civilian carry or was it designed specifically for duelling?
The blade features a series of X type crosses on each side.
I find it hard to accept that anyone interested in self-defence would wear such a sword.

Hi,

Egerton Castle, in his Schools and Masters Of fencing (pg237-8) describes such a sword as a 'Flamberg", an intermediary between the transition rapier and the small sword. He also wrote that these gradually gained great favour with the expert fencers of the seventeenth century on account of their relative lightness, and adding that they were most commonly used in Germany. According to Castle, part of their appeal was the simplified hilt which permitted fencing with either hand, as taught by some of the masters of that era.

Cheers
Chris

[urbanspaceman]

Thank-you Chris.

[M ELEY]

Fascinating information from all involved. I personally loved that movie 'The Duelist'. Just wanted to add that as far as fencing goes, the German academic schools also were heavily involved and it was quite popular to bare the scars provided by the matches, so much so that it became a Hollywood steriotype to show movie villains of the era with such scars-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dueling_scar

[urbanspaceman]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

Fascinating information from all involved. I personally loved that movie 'The Duelist'. Just wanted to add that as far as fencing goes, the German academic schools also were heavily involved and it was quite popular to bare the scars provided by the matches, so much so that it became a Hollywood steriotype to show movie villains of the era with such scars-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dueling_scar

That is a truly fascinating article on scars - thank-you - which I would never have encountered if not for your post.

[M ELEY]

Glad you liked it, Keith. Admittedly, I'm a wuss and would rather have not been scarred up in this way!

[urbanspaceman]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

Glad you liked it, Keith. Admittedly, I'm a wuss and would rather have not been scarred up in this way!

I only visit this planet occasionally, so I have to confess that the behaviour of the male species is sometimes even more perplexing than the female

[fernando]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

Glad you liked it, Keith. Admittedly, I'm a wuss and would rather have not been scarred up in this way!

Common sense, Captain ...common sense. Many years ago (long before Internet) i watched a documentary in the TV where a bunch of these guys 'fought' for a scar; close to each other, wearing goggles, crossing swords at high speed (you can't call it fencing, nor duelling) and looking to get cut; indeed the willing to get themselves a scar was more their goal than inflicting one to their foes.
In a different scenary, who doesn't remember the movie Royal Flash, where Malcom MacDowel (Flashman) had to be scarred in his face to impersonate the Danish prince; but at least here there was some practical sense ... so to say.


.

[mariusgmioc]

Originally Posted by fernando

Common sense, Captain ...common sense. Many years ago (long before Internet) i watched a documentary in the TV where a bunch of these guys 'fought' for a scar; close to each other, wearing goggles, crossing swords at high speed (you can't call it fencing, nor duelling) and looking to get cut; indeed the willing to get themselves a scar was more their goal than inflicting one to their foes.

.

As far as I remember this was a common practice... and fashion among German students in the 19th... maybe even early 20th century.

[Chris Evans]

Hi Fernando,

Is this what you were referring to? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OSaFdDko_k

Cheers
Chris

[fernando]

That's the one, Chris. Good catch .

[Chris Evans]

Originally Posted by urbanspaceman

Thank-you Chris.

And thank you for posting the link to that most informative paper on the Colichemarde.

Apropos to which, the conventional wisdom had it, as implied by Castle, that its demise was due to that whilst it served well parrying against heavier swords it was at a disadvantage, on account of its weight, against the lighter and therefore nimbler uniformly tapering triangular blades that became normative in France.

Having said that, I remember seeing some years ago (for sale) a matched pair of 19th century dueling epees with Colichemarde style blades - As to what purpose the wider fortes could serve in a duel with evenly matched swords I am at a loss to understand. Perhaps they were made on special order to an eccentric customer!

Cheers
Chris