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20th February 2021, 07:00 PM
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#1 |
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EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,280
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Not yet.
The "f" is a stylized shamshir. |
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20th February 2021, 10:41 PM
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#2 | |
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Member
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 830
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Quote:
 I know them to be seperate on a blade but not combined... Last edited by gp; 21st February 2021 at 10:03 AM. |
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21st February 2021, 07:26 PM
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#3 |
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EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,280
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Yeah have to admit I've not seen that before.
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3rd April 2021, 07:17 PM
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#4 |
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Member
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 830
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new family member...
unfortunately no scabbard but interesting the "w" or "m" type of motives one normally finds on the copper scabbard, are here found on the ferrule Total length: 28 cm. - 11 inch Blade length: 18 cm. - 7 inch Handle made from (buffalo or ox) bone your comments please...thank you Last edited by gp; 3rd April 2021 at 07:31 PM. |
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24th April 2021, 06:16 PM
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#5 | |
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 147
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Quote:
If it were not for the typical Balkan design of the hilt with brass inserts, then in the shape of the blade and fullers, I would have seen a Surmene knife. Last edited by Saracen; 24th April 2021 at 06:58 PM. |
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27th April 2021, 11:13 AM
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#6 | |
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Member
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 830
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Quote:
And both of us might be wright and wrong as the determination of origin is indeed not based upon pure mathematical science, not being the same of or no deduction of certain region's characteristics. Please allow me to elaborate: it would be too simple to explain it by the interaction of people moving around in the Ottoman empire as blacksmith both in the Ottoman empire and in Europe as well, were neither well to do nor had the ambition or freedom to move around...even if they would wish to. In general they would earn a good living where they were in the 17th, 18th, 19th and 20th century. A small exception could however have caused this : between 1860 and 1878, also in 1918 the Ottoman empire was shaken and quite a lot of people moved, some forcibly (a form of ethnic cleansing) whilst others voluntarily moved from east to west and west to east; from the Balkans to the Ottoman / Turkish territory or vice versa as states were created in the Balkans Obviously talking with them their cultural heritage. So you can find in present Turkey quite a lot peoples from plural national backgrounds / roots (Bosnian but also Greek). And the otherway around from the Black Sea erea, so also the Surmene / Sürmene region folks might have or had moved to the Balkans and with the cold weapons tradition in Bosnia it was easy for a Blacksmith Master /Majster to fit in and perhaps occassionally produce such a dagger. Still it doesn not exclude that it is either a fake or a Surmene copy of a Bosniak of that time.... Although I know a lot about the "Bosniaks" you can never be sure but I was more than willing & prepared to take the risk and add it to my collection. As you said it has too many details which could place it in Bosnia....if not...hard luck but still a very nice dagger  Thank you for your comment, which is highly appreciated and confirmed my thoughts as well : well done and my respect !!! Last edited by gp; 27th April 2021 at 03:57 PM. |
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2nd May 2021, 06:55 PM
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#7 | |
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 147
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Quote:
Sometimes they have a very similar decor of the handle, but even the blade characteristic for of the surmene knife does not allow us to confidently determine their origin. It would be very interesting to know more about these similarities. Last edited by Saracen; 2nd May 2021 at 11:29 PM. |
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