Small "Blingy" Knife, But From Where and What Was its Purpose???

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by CharlesS

I thought exactly the same, Detlef. But then there's the weird blade.

Like said, I never before I have seen a similar knife. I only want to point to a possible origin.

Regards,
Detlef

[Gavin Nugent]

My gut feel is minangkabau Betel nut knife.

[Ian]

Hi Gavin,

What are you seeing that persuades you this is from the Minangkabau people? That's an uncommon attribution with respect to blades.

Ian

P.S. Just to amplify a little on my earler post, attached are pics of klewang from v. Zonneveld's book Traditional Weapons of the Indonesian Archipelago, p. 70. Note no. 265 (from S. Sumatra) and 267 (from Sumatra) in relation to the shape of the blade on the small knife shown by Charles.
.

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by Ian

Hi Gavin,

What are you seeing that persuades you this is from the Minangkabau people? That's an uncommon attribution with respect to blades.

Ian

P.S. Just to amplify a little on my earler post, attached are pics of klewang from v. Zonneveld's book Traditional Weapons of the Indonesian Archipelago, p. 70. Note no. 265 (from S. Sumatra) and 267 (from Sumatra) in relation to the shape of the blade on the small knife shown by Charles.
.

Ian,

With respect to the blades, and it has not been quantified by Charles, but at face value looking at the scabbard, the blade is not on the inner curved edge but the outer edge

The examples you point to are blades with a cutting edge on the inner forward curving edge.

If Zonneveld is to be referred to, one could also point out page 126, figure 511 shows a sheath typical to the region of Minangkabau, akin to this example Charles presents.

Gavin

[Ian]

Gavin,

Thanks for the reference to the Minangkabau in v. Zonneveld.

With regard to the klewang he shows, the two I referred to have straight cutting edges and upturned hilts (which I suspect is the same as Charle's example). I have owned a couple of these and that is how the edge and hilt were oriented on both of them. Also, if you look at the pics I showed from v. Zonneveld's book, the upper and middle set of three all have their edges on the right hand side of the photograph, but the bottom two have their edges on the left.

As far as the split back of the scabbard, I think this has become more common on contemporary Indonesian scabbards. I do think the scabbard was more recently made than the knife.

Ian

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by Ian

Gavin,

Thanks for the reference to the Minangkabau in v. Zonneveld.

With regard to the klewang he shows, the two I referred to have straight cutting edges and upturned hilts (which I suspect is the same as Charle's example). I have owned a couple of these and that is how the edge and hilt were oriented on both of them. Also, if you look at the pics I showed from v. Zonneveld's book, the upper and middle set of three all have their edges on the right hand side of the photograph, but the bottom two have their edges on the left.

As far as the split back of the scabbard, I think this has become more common on contemporary Indonesian scabbards. I do think the scabbard was more recently made than the knife.

Ian

Hi Ian,

I beg to differ. Those pictured, 265, 267, the cutting is on the inside curve.

All those I've owned and sold of that particular type from Betel nut size to sword size and those still with me, this is the case too, the edge is on the inner curve.
Of all those pictured, these two, 265 & 267 are the exception where blade orientation is concerned.

Charles should be able to chime in on these two in the book, he's owned and sold the type too. I recall one he sold from the 4th April 2018.
Seek out one of my past sold listings, Sold item s1504. I don't believe I can provide my own links here

Gavin

[Ian]

Hi Gavin,

You may be correct. My experience with these klewang is different. Since Albert v. Zonneveld is a member of this forum, he might be able to tell us how his pictures are oriented.

Ian