Boabdil swords and Jineta

Philip · 27th September 2019, 10:28 PM

It gives the impression of being a later interpretation: if Victorian era then British India may be a possibility considering the ellyfunts. My recollection of Moorish art is that such depictions of animals tends to be quite out-of-place in the tradition. Which makes an anomaly such as the sculptures in the Court of Lions at the Alhambra in Granada so much more remarkable.

fernando · 27th September 2019, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philip

... Which makes an anomaly such as the sculptures in the Court of Lions at the Alhambra in Granada so much more remarkable.

fernando · 29th September 2019, 05:31 PM

I know this sword was already posted here but (i guess), the previous time there was no identity to it and, as i have just visited its residence (Toledo Army Mueum) i am posting it together with a humble transcription of the caption.

"THIS LUXURY SWORD IS ATTRIBUTED TO ONE OF THE PRINCIPAL MILITARY LEADERS OF THE NASRID PERIOD; ALI ATAR, WHO WAS ALCAIDE (MAYOR) OF LOJA AND BOABDIL’S FATHER IN LAW, THE LAST KING OF GRANADA. ACCORDING TO HISTORIOGRAPHIC TRADITION, THE CABALLERO LUCAS HURTADO HAS SNATCHED THE SWORD FROM ALI ATAR WHILST HE WAS FALLING DEATH DURING THE COURSE OF THE BATTLE OF LUCENA (21ST. APRIL 1483)".

Do i see a Moorish smith mark on the blade ?

.

Philip · 29th September 2019, 06:50 PM

Nando, the image does hint at Arabic calligraphy within the cartouche. Isn't it so frustrating to see something in a museum and either the lighting or the visual angle (behind glass, no less) stand in the way of a good photo?

fernando · 29th September 2019, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philip

Nando, the image does hint at Arabic calligraphy within the cartouche. Isn't it so frustrating to see something in a museum and either the lighting or the visual angle (behind glass, no less) stand in the way of a good photo?

Added by a lousy photographer, with a lousy camera, Filipe

.
... and the cartouche/mark is actually rather faded, by the way.

Philip · 29th September 2019, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

Added by a lousy photographer, with a lousy camera, Filipe

.
... and the cartouche/mark is actually rather faded, by the way.

Yeah the wear and pitting don't help but don't beat yourself up over equipment and talent, you actually take better pics than many that are posted on the forum.

I go light when traveling so typically take a very portable small Canon which does a decent job, but in situations like lousy museum displays, I whip out my phone and take "back up" pics. Sometime am surprised at how much better they turn out when I adjust them on my computer. This is from someone who likewise is not a very methodical photographer and who tends to "wing it" when it comes to using a lens...

29th September 2019, 05:31 PM	#3
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	I know this sword was already posted here but (i guess), the previous time there was no identity to it and, as i have just visited its residence (Toledo Army Mueum) i am posting it together with a humble transcription of the caption. "THIS LUXURY SWORD IS ATTRIBUTED TO ONE OF THE PRINCIPAL MILITARY LEADERS OF THE NASRID PERIOD; ALI ATAR, WHO WAS ALCAIDE (MAYOR) OF LOJA AND BOABDIL’S FATHER IN LAW, THE LAST KING OF GRANADA. ACCORDING TO HISTORIOGRAPHIC TRADITION, THE CABALLERO LUCAS HURTADO HAS SNATCHED THE SWORD FROM ALI ATAR WHILST HE WAS FALLING DEATH DURING THE COURSE OF THE BATTLE OF LUCENA (21ST. APRIL 1483)". Do i see a Moorish smith mark on the blade ? . Attached Images

27th September 2019, 10:28 PM	#1
Philip Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: California Posts: 1,036	It gives the impression of being a later interpretation: if Victorian era then British India may be a possibility considering the ellyfunts. My recollection of Moorish art is that such depictions of animals tends to be quite out-of-place in the tradition. Which makes an anomaly such as the sculptures in the Court of Lions at the Alhambra in Granada so much more remarkable.

29th September 2019, 06:50 PM	#4
Philip Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: California Posts: 1,036	Nando, the image does hint at Arabic calligraphy within the cartouche. Isn't it so frustrating to see something in a museum and either the lighting or the visual angle (behind glass, no less) stand in the way of a good photo?