Another Acquisition--Keris style spear

MichaelZWilliamson · 11th November 2018, 04:05 AM

Tombak Pand o/p? u l/j?

Pamor rambany or kambany

pake or pare

A. G. Maisey · 11th November 2018, 07:05 AM

Thanks Michael, but it looks like its not much easier to read in hand than in the pics.

I cannot improve on the word after "tombak" , and the word "pandan" does not make much sense for a blade with waves, if it were to be a straight blade we might hypothesise that to somebody, somewhere it was dhapur (shape) pandan, but it cannot be that with luk.

rambany and kambany do not exist in Indonesian or Javanese, but rambang which can mean "wide" or "extensive" in Indonesian, and about half a dozen things in Javanese, do exist, and kambang which can mean a "threshold" or a "sill" in Indonesian and "to float" in Javanese do exist. In this context, attached to the word pamor, none of these words add meaning.

pake is a corruption of "pakai"

Pare is a town in East Jawa.

Not much gold in any of that, if we can guess , I'd guess it is a collector's label and the collector was not a speaker of the language, he got things mixed up..

I'm OK with Bahasa Indonesia and Javanese, and a bit less so with Balinese. This looks like a Javanese tombak, but maybe we're dealing with a different language here.

Sorry I was unable to help.

Thanks Michael, but it looks like its not much easier to read in hand than in the pics.

I cannot improve on the word after "tombak" , and the word "pandan" does not make much sense for a blade with waves, if it were to be a straight blade we might hypothesise that to somebody, somewhere it was dhapur (shape) pandan, but it cannot be that with luk.

rambany and kambany do not exist in Indonesian or Javanese, but rambang which can mean "wide" or "extensive" in Indonesian, and about half a dozen things in Javanese, do exist, and kambang which can mean a "threshold" or a "sill" in Indonesian and "to float" in Javanese do exist. In this context, attached to the word pamor, none of these words add meaning.

pake is a corruption of "pakai"

Pare is a town in East Jawa.

Not much gold in any of that, if we can guess , I'd guess it is a collector's label and the collector was not a speaker of the language, he got things mixed up..

I'm OK with Bahasa Indonesia and Javanese, and a bit less so with Balinese. This looks like a Javanese tombak, but maybe we're dealing with a different language here.

Sorry I was unable to help.

EDIT

Here is a stray thought that wandered in:- there is some of the label missing, if we can conjure the word "pandowo" out of the word following tombak, then I believe that what we might have is somebody's opinion of the dhapur of this tombak, ie, "Dhapur Pandowo (Pandawa)". Dhapur Pandowo is a 5 luk dhapur in keris, people who do not really understand keris will often grab a keris dhapur and stick it on a tombak, irrespective of whether this is correct or not. In this case it is not correct, but keris terminology is often a different in different places, so I'm backing "Tombak Pandowo", I think.

All we need now is some thinking out of the square for the pamor.
Pamor Kambang? Never heard of it, floating pamor? Maybe that was right somewhere, some time. Who knows?

11th November 2018, 04:05 AM	#1
MichaelZWilliamson Member Join Date: Nov 2018 Posts: 50	Tombak Pand o/p? u l/j? Pamor rambany or kambany pake or pare Attached Images

11th November 2018, 07:05 AM	#2
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Thanks Michael, but it looks like its not much easier to read in hand than in the pics. I cannot improve on the word after "tombak" , and the word "pandan" does not make much sense for a blade with waves, if it were to be a straight blade we might hypothesise that to somebody, somewhere it was dhapur (shape) pandan, but it cannot be that with luk. rambany and kambany do not exist in Indonesian or Javanese, but rambang which can mean "wide" or "extensive" in Indonesian, and about half a dozen things in Javanese, do exist, and kambang which can mean a "threshold" or a "sill" in Indonesian and "to float" in Javanese do exist. In this context, attached to the word pamor, none of these words add meaning. pake is a corruption of "pakai" Pare is a town in East Jawa. Not much gold in any of that, if we can guess , I'd guess it is a collector's label and the collector was not a speaker of the language, he got things mixed up.. I'm OK with Bahasa Indonesia and Javanese, and a bit less so with Balinese. This looks like a Javanese tombak, but maybe we're dealing with a different language here. Sorry I was unable to help. Thanks Michael, but it looks like its not much easier to read in hand than in the pics. I cannot improve on the word after "tombak" , and the word "pandan" does not make much sense for a blade with waves, if it were to be a straight blade we might hypothesise that to somebody, somewhere it was dhapur (shape) pandan, but it cannot be that with luk. rambany and kambany do not exist in Indonesian or Javanese, but rambang which can mean "wide" or "extensive" in Indonesian, and about half a dozen things in Javanese, do exist, and kambang which can mean a "threshold" or a "sill" in Indonesian and "to float" in Javanese do exist. In this context, attached to the word pamor, none of these words add meaning. pake is a corruption of "pakai" Pare is a town in East Jawa. Not much gold in any of that, if we can guess , I'd guess it is a collector's label and the collector was not a speaker of the language, he got things mixed up.. I'm OK with Bahasa Indonesia and Javanese, and a bit less so with Balinese. This looks like a Javanese tombak, but maybe we're dealing with a different language here. Sorry I was unable to help. EDIT Here is a stray thought that wandered in:- there is some of the label missing, if we can conjure the word "pandowo" out of the word following tombak, then I believe that what we might have is somebody's opinion of the dhapur of this tombak, ie, "Dhapur Pandowo (Pandawa)". Dhapur Pandowo is a 5 luk dhapur in keris, people who do not really understand keris will often grab a keris dhapur and stick it on a tombak, irrespective of whether this is correct or not. In this case it is not correct, but keris terminology is often a different in different places, so I'm backing "Tombak Pandowo", I think. All we need now is some thinking out of the square for the pamor. Pamor Kambang? Never heard of it, floating pamor? Maybe that was right somewhere, some time. Who knows? Last edited by A. G. Maisey; 11th November 2018 at 09:03 AM.