Islamic sword from toledo

mariusgmioc · 7th March 2018, 10:36 PM

Can you please show us the whole sword?

Regards,

Marius

Oliver Pinchot · 7th March 2018, 10:59 PM

It's not Arabic

M ELEY · 8th March 2018, 11:38 AM

Siamese? Tibetan? Bhutan?

kronckew · 8th March 2018, 11:50 AM

I think it's mock/ersatz arabic, for decorative purposes by someone illiterate in arabic calligraphy.

kronckew · 8th March 2018, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

Can you please show us the whole sword?

Regards,

Marius

Attached

note the reinforced forte/ricasso area.

fernando · 8th March 2018, 12:31 PM

Modern ?

carlos · 8th March 2018, 12:50 PM

The work in handle is typical from Toledo and is known as Damasquinado. I think this piece could be from 1920 more or leas. Is a beatiful sword. The Fábrica de Toledo made some copies of swords from different ages.
I love this sword! If some day you want send me ...😀😀
Carlos

Roland_M · 8th March 2018, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

Attached

note the reinforced forte/ricasso area.

What a beautiful sword! These Arabesques are among the best I ever saw!

I tend to date the sword back to the 19th ct..

Roland

mariusgmioc · 8th March 2018, 06:23 PM

Beautiful it is but unfortunately it is just a purely decorative piece not even a reproduction of a hystorical sword... at least none I can recognize.

Battara · 9th March 2018, 12:42 AM

My first thought was an artificially aged copy. Then the blade bending -

fernando · 9th March 2018, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

... My first thought was an artificially aged copy...

Mine as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

... Then the blade bending -

More of an Indian trick, right ?

fernando · 9th March 2018, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

Beautiful it is but unfortunately it is just a purely decorative piece not even a reproduction of a hystorical sword... at least none I can recognize.

I have been in Toledo (for the second time) the other day. The city is infested with sword (and armour) copies, being offered in hotel lobbies and all kinds of shop windows; Boadbil jinetas face to face with unreal things you see (or not) in fiction movies. On the other hand i wouldn't take it for certain that this piece was made in Spain.

mariusgmioc · 9th March 2018, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

On the other hand i wouldn't take it for certain that this piece was made in Spain.

I also have major doubts that it was made in Spain. Much more likely it is a "toledized" Jian, made in China.

midelburgo · 13th June 2018, 04:58 PM

These were from the 1870s to 1880s. There was a workshop at the Toledo Factory working with silver and gold inlays. The main artisan was Zuloaga, a brother to the famous painter, although I think he was more often at Eibar.

There is another piece from this workshop in this thread:

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=21551

Often they are idealized weapons with a now absurd romantic or oriental-like aspect.

There is a book on this:

https://www.khalilicollections.org/p...li-collection/

I have myself a cup hilt rapier dated 1881. I do not think from Zuloagas himself. The piece is hopeless as a weapon, too heavy, wrong balance, too stiff, too long (1.25m plus). It has three different gold tones (out of reach now). Main gauches are often seen in this style.

The horrors you can see in Toledo tourist pieces, mainly from the 1950s to 1970s are trying to imitate with acid etching and red and gold paint the old workshop. Last two pictures.

13th June 2018, 04:58 PM	#14
midelburgo Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 263	These were from the 1870s to 1880s. There was a workshop at the Toledo Factory working with silver and gold inlays. The main artisan was Zuloaga, a brother to the famous painter, although I think he was more often at Eibar. There is another piece from this workshop in this thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=21551 Often they are idealized weapons with a now absurd romantic or oriental-like aspect. There is a book on this: https://www.khalilicollections.org/p...li-collection/ I have myself a cup hilt rapier dated 1881. I do not think from Zuloagas himself. The piece is hopeless as a weapon, too heavy, wrong balance, too stiff, too long (1.25m plus). It has three different gold tones (out of reach now). Main gauches are often seen in this style. The horrors you can see in Toledo tourist pieces, mainly from the 1950s to 1970s are trying to imitate with acid etching and red and gold paint the old workshop. Last two pictures. Attached Images Last edited by midelburgo; 13th June 2018 at 05:44 PM.

7th March 2018, 10:36 PM	#1
mariusgmioc Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austria Posts: 1,906	Can you please show us the whole sword? Regards, Marius

7th March 2018, 10:59 PM	#2
Oliver Pinchot Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 462	It's not Arabic

8th March 2018, 11:38 AM	#3
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	Siamese? Tibetan? Bhutan?

8th March 2018, 11:50 AM	#4
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,215	I think it's mock/ersatz arabic, for decorative purposes by someone illiterate in arabic calligraphy.

8th March 2018, 12:31 PM	#6
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Modern ?

8th March 2018, 12:50 PM	#7
carlos Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 748	The work in handle is typical from Toledo and is known as Damasquinado. I think this piece could be from 1920 more or leas. Is a beatiful sword. The Fábrica de Toledo made some copies of swords from different ages. I love this sword! If some day you want send me ...😀😀 Carlos

8th March 2018, 06:23 PM	#9
mariusgmioc Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austria Posts: 1,906	Beautiful it is but unfortunately it is just a purely decorative piece not even a reproduction of a hystorical sword... at least none I can recognize.

9th March 2018, 12:42 AM	#10
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,270	My first thought was an artificially aged copy. Then the blade bending -