European Wootz?

[Roland_M]

Originally Posted by kai

It seems that the corrosion is not really following the pattern which seems odd for any type of patterned steel, isn't it?

Regards,
Kai

It depends on the way how the blade was stored, within the scabbard or not, dry or wet conditions, oiled or not. In most cases the front of the sword is most corroded.

The pattern is of importance for the corrosion if we have a rough grain with openings. If we have a fine grain without openings, the corrosion sensivity is much lower.

I think this beautiful sword is a Oriental contract work for a European customer. I know, that deeply curved Persian or Ottoman swords has been very popular in the armys of Napoleonic time. Proven officers often had been rewarded with mameluke sword types.


Regards,
Roland

[Bryce]

G'day Guys,

Thanks for your feedback. This blade type seems to have been particularly favoured by British officers serving in India. I was thinking that this sword was a special order from an officer who had served in India and had seen wootz blades and wanted something with the same look. I have read that European swordsmiths were trying to recreate wootz blades around this time. Maybe this is an example of their attempts?

Most quill-points are relatively straight. This one is slightly more curved than normal. Below is a photo comparing it to a more regular heavy cavalry example.

Cheers,
Bryce

[Helleri]

You said there are no marking on the sword or scabbard that would tell you who made it. Is that typical of these?

[Bryce]

G'day Helleri,

Most British swords of this era are marked, but there are many that aren't, so not unusual.

Cheers,
Bryce

[Victrix]

What was the point with quill point swords? Were there any practical reasons for them, or mostly for show? It looks like a variation of the false edge of a sabre and the "T" back of a Kilic.

[scinde]

Originally Posted by Victrix

What was the point with quill point swords? Were there any practical reasons for them, or mostly for show? It looks like a variation of the false edge of a sabre and the "T" back of a Kilic.

Officers of the Bombay Light Cavalry carried stirrup hilted swords with the quill point at a time that is likely contemporary with the sword that features in this post; with swords marked to the 1st and 2nd regiments having been sighted.

Swords with quill-pointed blades were still being purchased by some cavalry officers of the EIC in the middle 1850s (largely irregular cavalry), as it appears the ram-rod back (or pipe-back) to the blade was considered more rigid, and combined with the style of point, better used to penetrate mail.

Swords with the ram-rod back, but no pronounced quill point were also made for cavalry troopers at the time of the Mutiny of 1857, with use likely extending into the 1860s. There is also evidence that suggest that quill-pointed blades were still with some officers, some time after the mutiny.

[Philip]

Weren't swords based on regulation patterns sometimes made-to-order for British officers by native swordsmiths in India?

[Bryce]

G'day Guys,

So the jury is out? If only the smith had marked his work. Were Eastern smiths still producing wootz at this time?

Cheers,
Bryce

[MForde]

Originally Posted by Philip

Weren't swords based on regulation patterns sometimes made-to-order for British officers by native swordsmiths in India?

There are certainly Indian-made variations on the 1845 Pattern Sabre. I think I had one for the State of Kotar that replaced the Victoria Regina in the cartouche for a more local symbol.

[Bryce]

Originally Posted by Victrix

What was the point with quill point swords? Were there any practical reasons for them, or mostly for show? It looks like a variation of the false edge of a sabre and the "T" back of a Kilic.

G'day Victrix,

The quill-point was an attempt to make a straight thrusting sword that had a curved cutting edge. It is a good thrusting sword, but unfortunately the thick, reinforced spine gets in the way of a good cut. Nevertheless, it can still deliver a nasty slash. It also has a very sharp, but still strong point.

It looks frightening, but I suspect it wasn't that effective in combat, hence the short service life, (except in India and in a shortened naval form).

Cheers,

Bryce