A cup hilt rapier for id.

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by fernando

Here Jim,
This may not have anything ... or everything to do it.
Tirri depicting a talwar with a hilt having its pommel removed to accomodate a 'larger' hand. Larger than what ?

.

Of course......Tirri!!!
To add to the conjecture on the Indian hilt/hand size conundrum:

Notes from Burton, and other cited in "Hindu Arms & Ritual" 2004, Elgood, footnote #85 (p.297);
"...the personal weapons of Sivaji were preserved at Satara and Kolhapur after his death in 1680. Grant Duff in "Notes of an Indian Journey" (1876) described the worship of the Bhawani at Satara as did Burton in 'Sword' (1884) who recorded a Genoa blade of great length and fine temper though it is not clear whether he saw it himself.
He cites a Mrs Guthrie who did see it, saying it was a fine Ferrara blade, four feet in length, with a spike upon the hilt to thrust with'.
She also noticed THE SMALLNESS OF THE GRIP.

It seems there are no real sound answers on this, and while the notion of physical hand size being a factor in grip size, there is not a consensus as to how consistant such instances might apply. I have seen a tulwar from the Northwest Frontier which has provenance it was used in this manner, with no disc. It was captured by a British officer in 1930 from an Afghan warrior, and was among his other memento's shown to me when I interviewed him in the 90s.
It was said in other research on Afghan weapons, that the physical stature of tribesmen of these regions, was typically larger than that of the Hindu's to the south. This was not documented but in personal communications.

Thank you for the follow up Fernando.

Jim

[werecow]

I thought I'd add a data point to this thread in the form of this rapier I recently came across on a Spanish collector's site with a similar thumb ring.