When in India "died" wootz?

mahratt · 15th February 2016, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estcrh

Then the same thing that happened to wootz production in Indian seems to have happened in Persia as well.

I think in Persia this happened to the fact that the army was to move to a European arms. Detachments of irregular cavalry (with ethnic weapon) in Persia were not as significant as for example in Afghanistan or Central Asia. By the way it was from Persia to Central Asia brought blades for swords (including wootz blades) until the 1880s.

Battara · 15th February 2016, 04:14 PM

I'm thinking that this is the case with many countries/cultures. It seems that Western arms replaced the need for the beautiful wootz in India, Persia, the Ottoman Empire, and other sites. Though understandable, it is still a shame. Only recently has it been rediscovered after lots of research and lots and lots of experimentation.

ariel · 15th February 2016, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

I'm thinking that this is the case with many countries/cultures. It seems that Western arms replaced the need for the beautiful wootz in India, Persia, the Ottoman Empire, and other sites. Though understandable, it is still a shame. Only recently has it been rediscovered after lots of research and lots and lots of experimentation.

... and still unable to compare esthetically:-)

But other than the beauty of it, wootz ( old and modern) is still inferior to industially-made steels of today. From the technological point of view we shouldn't be ruing its disappearance. From the esthetical one, the inferior appearance of new wootz blades is also not a bad thing: a blade with a beautiful wootz pattern has a built-in guarantee of being a real antique:-)

mahratt · 15th February 2016, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

I'm thinking that this is the case with many countries/cultures. It seems that Western arms replaced the need for the beautiful wootz in India, Persia, the Ottoman Empire, and other sites. Though understandable, it is still a shame. Only recently has it been rediscovered after lots of research and lots and lots of experimentation.

You're right, Battara.

The question is when it happened. In the middle of the 19th century or early 20th century. Agree - this is a big difference.

Jens Nordlunde · 15th February 2016, 09:36 PM

Maharatt,
It seem to me, that when this thread has had 65 posts so far, and none of them has been to your satisfacthion, we may conclude, that no one on this forum can give the right answer - so I suggest that you will give us your final word.

mahratt · 15th February 2016, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jens Nordlunde

Maharatt,
It seem to me, that when this thread has had 65 posts so far, and none of them has been to your satisfacthion, we may conclude, that no one on this forum can give the right answer - so I suggest that you will give us your final word.

Jens, it's not that no one on the forum can not give the correct answer. The fact is that there is no literature of the 19th century, which can confirm that by the mid-19th century, the production wootz and manufacture of wootz steel blades in the East ceased. Yes, in India the era of wootz steel is likely to end in the middle of the 19th century. But remained Persia, Afghanistan and Central Asia ...

No responses yet. There are more questions

I think this topic is interesting. And requires further searches the literature of the 19th century, which will help us to discover the secrets of the disappearance of wootz steel.
I think. work together to find simpler. I'm looking for an old Russian literature of the 19th century, where they write about the wootz. For example, in Russian book "Journey to the north of Persia" it is written that in Tehran in a in 1852 did many wootz steel recurved dagger. You are looking at the same books in the English language. For example. I found the book: "Travels in the Panjab, Afghanistan , & Turkistan, to Balk, Bokhara, and Herat and a visit to Great Britain and Germany",1846. Mohana Lāla Munshi

Perhaps write about wootz steel in this book. But, I can not read it quickly, because I know English is bad.

Jens Nordlunde · 16th February 2016, 12:42 PM

mahratt,
Yes you are right, it is up to you to stop the thread. I cant help you any further with your question, as I have never esearched the question very deeply.

mahratt · 16th February 2016, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jens Nordlunde

mahratt,
Yes you are right, it is up to you to stop the thread. I cant help you any further with your question, as I have never esearched the question very deeply.

Jens, I'm sorry for seditious words. I hope I did no one not offend these words.

Do not you think that it is much more interesting more global issues related to the ethnographic weapons (especially now since it is possible through of modern technology, when many old books became available) than just discuss something like: "Look, what my lovely saber" or "Guys, what the name of this dagger?"

Of course, it is also necessary. But there are more interesting questions. And we can work together to find answers to them. At least try to do it.

15th February 2016, 04:14 PM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,280	I'm thinking that this is the case with many countries/cultures. It seems that Western arms replaced the need for the beautiful wootz in India, Persia, the Ottoman Empire, and other sites. Though understandable, it is still a shame. Only recently has it been rediscovered after lots of research and lots and lots of experimentation.

15th February 2016, 09:36 PM	#5
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Maharatt, It seem to me, that when this thread has had 65 posts so far, and none of them has been to your satisfacthion, we may conclude, that no one on this forum can give the right answer - so I suggest that you will give us your final word.

16th February 2016, 12:42 PM	#7
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	mahratt, Yes you are right, it is up to you to stop the thread. I cant help you any further with your question, as I have never esearched the question very deeply.