Three new talibon enter my collection

Sajen · 28th August 2014, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian

Kumusta Tito:

Nice scores Detlef. The first two look like typical early 20th C talibon/garab but the horn-hilted one seems unusual in several ways.

First, the horn hilt is very uncommon (I don't recall another example--I've seen only wooden hilts). Second, the carved "figure" at the end of the hilt is of a form that I've not seen on another talibon or other Visayan weapons--it looks perhaps Indonesian to me, while the "curly hair" reminds me of the creature on the hilt of a Singhalese kastane. Third, I'm having trouble seeing a beveled edge on this one--it could be V-ground, which I have not seen on talibon/garab before. Fourth, the S-shape to the blade is not as pronounced as most talibon--the belly is a little more forward than most (compared with your other two, for example), while the narrowing at forte is a little less pronounced than most talibon. Lastly, the blade looks thin at the forte in one of the pictures and this would be very unusual for a talibon which is typically quite "chunky" in that area.

In favor of this being a talibon is the typical wooden sheath that is characteristically eastern Visayan in construction and style.

So, I think the horn-hilted one is not your typical talibon, perhaps a knife from elsewhere in Visayan dress. Examination in hand will make it apparent to you whether this is a typical talibon, and better pictures would decide the issue for us.

Congrats again on three good scores.

Ian.

Kumusta Ian,

you are correct, I am with you, never before (when I remember correct) I have seen a talibon with a monster hilt but think that I have seen a few with horn hilts. The blade is beveled, I've asked the seller and he confirmed that one side is flat and the other beveled. But frankly said I haven't asked him how thick the blade is at the forte, we will see when it is arrived at the destination.
Thank you for your good observations and thoughts!

Regards,
Detlef

Sajen · 28th August 2014, 06:20 PM

In this thread pictured two talibon/garab with horn handle: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=garab
see post #20 & #28
And here: http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001242.html Barry have shown a talibon with horn monster handle, very different style but a monster head.

Battara · 29th August 2014, 01:33 AM

In the last link, I think the one with the horn hilt ands monster head is actually from Bicol. They use monster heads too.....

Which then brings up an interesting question: could your horn hilt be from Bicol? The head is not the typical type often found on Bicolano pieces, but you never know......

Sajen · 29th August 2014, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

In the last link, I think the one with the horn hilt ands monster head is actually from Bicol. They use monster heads too.....

Which then brings up an interesting question: could your horn hilt be from Bicol? The head is not the typical type often found on Bicolano pieces, but you never know......

You could be correct that the one from Barry is from Bicol, maybe Barry can chime in and can tell us more.

Do you ever have seen a talibon from Bicol? Or you think only the handle is maybe Bicolano? Frankly said the sword look in all parts original to my eyes so far to seen by the seller pictures.

Regards,
Detlef

Battara · 29th August 2014, 03:32 PM

I am only suggesting the possibility that the hilt and perhaps the blade may be Bicolano. The scabbard is certainly tailbone/garab.

Sajen · 29th August 2014, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

I am only suggesting the possibility that the hilt and perhaps the blade may be Bicolano. The scabbard is certainly tailbone/garab.

When the blade is beveled like the seller stated I doubt that that the blade is Bicolano. We will see when the sword arrived at the destination if the fit inside the scabbard is original.

Best,
Detlef

Robert · 29th August 2014, 08:57 PM

I agree that the hilt is more than likely original to the blade. What I am waiting to hear is whether the blade fits the scabbard correctly. It might not prove that it is the original scabbard, but will at least show that it was more than likely made for this piece. One thing brought up was that this having a horn hilt was unusual, I have never noticed horn hilts to be unusual on talibong though more with wooden hilts seem to be available, but that looks to be the norm on most Philippine pieces. The carving on the hilt does seem to have more of an Indonesian look to it as Ian has already pointed out. The face reminds me of some of the tenegre hilts that I have seen only narrower and that could possibly be due to nothing more than the person who did the carving adding it after the hilt had originally been carved in a more traditional style.

We will know more about it after it has arrived and Detlef has had a chance to clean, inspect and post clear and detailed photos that will help in its identification.

Best,
Robert

P.S. It is still my favorite of the group.

28th August 2014, 06:20 PM	#2
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,164	In this thread pictured two talibon/garab with horn handle: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=garab see post #20 & #28 And here: http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001242.html Barry have shown a talibon with horn monster handle, very different style but a monster head.

29th August 2014, 01:33 AM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	In the last link, I think the one with the horn hilt ands monster head is actually from Bicol. They use monster heads too..... Which then brings up an interesting question: could your horn hilt be from Bicol? The head is not the typical type often found on Bicolano pieces, but you never know......

29th August 2014, 03:32 PM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	I am only suggesting the possibility that the hilt and perhaps the blade may be Bicolano. The scabbard is certainly tailbone/garab.

29th August 2014, 08:57 PM	#7
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	I agree that the hilt is more than likely original to the blade. What I am waiting to hear is whether the blade fits the scabbard correctly. It might not prove that it is the original scabbard, but will at least show that it was more than likely made for this piece. One thing brought up was that this having a horn hilt was unusual, I have never noticed horn hilts to be unusual on talibong though more with wooden hilts seem to be available, but that looks to be the norm on most Philippine pieces. The carving on the hilt does seem to have more of an Indonesian look to it as Ian has already pointed out. The face reminds me of some of the tenegre hilts that I have seen only narrower and that could possibly be due to nothing more than the person who did the carving adding it after the hilt had originally been carved in a more traditional style. We will know more about it after it has arrived and Detlef has had a chance to clean, inspect and post clear and detailed photos that will help in its identification. Best, Robert P.S. It is still my favorite of the group.