Composite Sumatran keris?

Sajen · 25th February 2014, 08:41 PM

Hello again,

I am nearly sure that you have there a very nice and rare keris Bugis Terengganu or Kelantan, the sheath form is called kusiwo or pucuk kacang. Sadly our Malay members are not anymore very active here in the forum but maybe one of them will jump in and will be able to tell you more.
Attached is a picture of a Terrengganu keris in a similar sheath taken from Malay-art-gallery (sold one). The form is not direct the same but like said similar. The wood from your sheath is made from kemuning IMHO.
When you not happy with this keris I would be happy to take it from your hands!!

Regards,
Detlef

David · 25th February 2014, 09:14 PM

I am inclined to agree with Detlef that this may not be a composite piece, but fully Malay in origin. I'm not sure that you nailed the sheath ID however, since there are some more than subtle differences with the one you posted. I am a bit confused by the way the stem terminates as most that i see from the Malay side tend to have flat bottom, not this rounded end.
It would be nice to see Kai Wee or Shahrial comment here as these types of keris are really their area of study.

Sajen · 25th February 2014, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

I am inclined to agree with Detlef that this may not be a composite piece, but fully Malay in origin. I'm not sure that you nailed the sheath ID however, since there are some more than subtle differences with the one you posted. I am a bit confused by the way the stem terminates as most that i see from the Malay side tend to have flat bottom, not this rounded end.
It would be nice to see Kai Wee or Shahrial comment here as these types of keris are really their area of study.

Hi David, I am not 100% sure about the sheath form as well but think that I have seen it before and agree also that the stem end is very unusual. And I am with you, would like to read the opinion from Kai Wee, Sharial or Dave. Also Gustav may be able to tell us more.

Regards,
Detlef

KLUNGKLUNG · 27th February 2014, 10:36 AM

Thanks for the comments and hope the additional pics will be helpful and an invitation for more background information.....
My observations:
The ganja is peeping out slightly but not uncommon.
The tip end of both warangka wings are missing a small chip and the back of the sampir showing very fine haircracks indicating age, so does the dark dusty slot opening imo.

A. G. Maisey · 27th February 2014, 11:36 AM

Wrongko looks like a Madura kacir to me --- at least that's what this form is called in Solo. Don't know what it might be called in Madura.

The pendongkok/mendak looks like Surabaya work.

I'll reserve comment on what I think the origin of the complete piece might be.

Moshah · 14th March 2014, 03:32 AM

Hi there,

The hilt was bona fide Peninsula Malay, called Pekaka hilt locally, and famously attributed to the state of Kelantan & Pattani.

Usually a decent, old specimen would be in dark-yellowish tone, ageing naturally. Yours is a bit whitish, perhaps being polished with autosol or something - which is kinda degrading it's authenticity of ageing over here.

Blade could be Terengganu, but I think if you can post some pictures of the blade portion itself (base, mid and tip), maybe some other member can put more words into it...

This type of sheath was really a puzzling debate before. Pardon my experience and knowledge, but I can not confirm it was of Peninsula origin; I did not see much of this type around here but definitely there were a few, and it is always on blades which would be spotted with Coteng hilts - and usually attributed to Singgora (Songhkla) of Thailand. NEVER on a Bugis blade.

DAHenkel · 15th March 2014, 05:36 AM

A curious piece. Looks all Peninsular to me but with a sheath modelled after a Javanese Pasisir type. Others have already mentioned Madura but you also see similar sheaths all along the North coast. Its clearly well made and had seen some wear and tear it so its not just a made up or souvenier piece. Who knows what the real story behind it is but its certainly very rare. Good find!

25th February 2014, 08:41 PM	#1
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,207	Hello again, I am nearly sure that you have there a very nice and rare keris Bugis Terengganu or Kelantan, the sheath form is called kusiwo or pucuk kacang. Sadly our Malay members are not anymore very active here in the forum but maybe one of them will jump in and will be able to tell you more. Attached is a picture of a Terrengganu keris in a similar sheath taken from Malay-art-gallery (sold one). The form is not direct the same but like said similar. The wood from your sheath is made from kemuning IMHO. When you not happy with this keris I would be happy to take it from your hands!! Regards, Detlef Attached Images Last edited by Sajen; 25th February 2014 at 08:53 PM.

27th February 2014, 10:36 AM	#4
KLUNGKLUNG Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 24	Thanks for the comments and hope the additional pics will be helpful and an invitation for more background information..... My observations: The ganja is peeping out slightly but not uncommon. The tip end of both warangka wings are missing a small chip and the back of the sampir showing very fine haircracks indicating age, so does the dark dusty slot opening imo. Attached Images

25th February 2014, 09:14 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,218	I am inclined to agree with Detlef that this may not be a composite piece, but fully Malay in origin. I'm not sure that you nailed the sheath ID however, since there are some more than subtle differences with the one you posted. I am a bit confused by the way the stem terminates as most that i see from the Malay side tend to have flat bottom, not this rounded end. It would be nice to see Kai Wee or Shahrial comment here as these types of keris are really their area of study.

27th February 2014, 11:36 AM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Wrongko looks like a Madura kacir to me --- at least that's what this form is called in Solo. Don't know what it might be called in Madura. The pendongkok/mendak looks like Surabaya work. I'll reserve comment on what I think the origin of the complete piece might be.

14th March 2014, 03:32 AM	#6
Moshah Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 171	Hi there, The hilt was bona fide Peninsula Malay, called Pekaka hilt locally, and famously attributed to the state of Kelantan & Pattani. Usually a decent, old specimen would be in dark-yellowish tone, ageing naturally. Yours is a bit whitish, perhaps being polished with autosol or something - which is kinda degrading it's authenticity of ageing over here. Blade could be Terengganu, but I think if you can post some pictures of the blade portion itself (base, mid and tip), maybe some other member can put more words into it... This type of sheath was really a puzzling debate before. Pardon my experience and knowledge, but I can not confirm it was of Peninsula origin; I did not see much of this type around here but definitely there were a few, and it is always on blades which would be spotted with Coteng hilts - and usually attributed to Singgora (Songhkla) of Thailand. NEVER on a Bugis blade.

15th March 2014, 05:36 AM	#7
DAHenkel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 125	A curious piece. Looks all Peninsular to me but with a sheath modelled after a Javanese Pasisir type. Others have already mentioned Madura but you also see similar sheaths all along the North coast. Its clearly well made and had seen some wear and tear it so its not just a made up or souvenier piece. Who knows what the real story behind it is but its certainly very rare. Good find!