Berber Cavalry Saber ??

archer · 9th June 2013, 03:22 AM

Do the sabers with Spanish motto's, etc, also have the tapered tang? The Berber photos are a stretch, but, if you look at the shadows cast by the hilts, the silhouettes take on to my eye the proper shape.
M Eley, Do the scabbards follow this odd blade protected by wood insert and a layer of leather on the outside and only leather on the inside? More importantly were both tangs tapered? Do the M1796 British Sabers have tapered tangs? Thanks Steve

I added a few photos that may help on origins?

M ELEY · 9th June 2013, 01:01 PM

Every example of Brazilian espada/cutlass I have seen lack a scabbard. It could be that none survived or that they were never intended to have a scabbard (if a true naval cutlass, they shouldn't). Getting back to the scabbard on yours, my Berber saber had a similar raised 'toe'. The hilts on these are all very similar, of horn slats pinned together. Not to confuse matters, but espada ancha also have similar hilt constructions (horn or bone slats with a tang sandwiched in the middle with pins/rivets holding them in place. The tang on my Berber was tapered, but I can't see the tang on my Brazilian piece as the horn hilt fully covers it. I've heard the theories of m1796 blades being used, but not sure what their tang was shaped like. Certainly, the tangs might have been altered/flattened to allow for the horn slats. After all, many of the Berber sabers had their points purposely clipped to form a 'crescent moon' shape. I assume you might have already looked up the thread 'On the origins of the so-called Berber sabre'? Some very interesting info there...

9th June 2013, 03:22 AM	#1
archer Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 373	Questions Do the sabers with Spanish motto's, etc, also have the tapered tang? The Berber photos are a stretch, but, if you look at the shadows cast by the hilts, the silhouettes take on to my eye the proper shape. M Eley, Do the scabbards follow this odd blade protected by wood insert and a layer of leather on the outside and only leather on the inside? More importantly were both tangs tapered? Do the M1796 British Sabers have tapered tangs? Thanks Steve I added a few photos that may help on origins? Attached Images Last edited by archer; 9th June 2013 at 03:30 AM. Reason: add two photos

9th June 2013, 01:01 PM	#2
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	Every example of Brazilian espada/cutlass I have seen lack a scabbard. It could be that none survived or that they were never intended to have a scabbard (if a true naval cutlass, they shouldn't). Getting back to the scabbard on yours, my Berber saber had a similar raised 'toe'. The hilts on these are all very similar, of horn slats pinned together. Not to confuse matters, but espada ancha also have similar hilt constructions (horn or bone slats with a tang sandwiched in the middle with pins/rivets holding them in place. The tang on my Berber was tapered, but I can't see the tang on my Brazilian piece as the horn hilt fully covers it. I've heard the theories of m1796 blades being used, but not sure what their tang was shaped like. Certainly, the tangs might have been altered/flattened to allow for the horn slats. After all, many of the Berber sabers had their points purposely clipped to form a 'crescent moon' shape. I assume you might have already looked up the thread 'On the origins of the so-called Berber sabre'? Some very interesting info there... Last edited by M ELEY; 9th June 2013 at 01:15 PM.