Identification Help Needed

Robert · 17th November 2012, 06:28 PM

Hello Detlef and thank you for your thoughts on this. As soon as it arrives I will clean the blade and might even do a light etch with vinegar to see what shows up before posting new pictures.
By chance does any forum member have an example of a parang ginah like this that they might possibly post for comparison? Again, my thanks to everyone that has helped so far in identifying this piece.

Regards,
Robert

DAHenkel · 20th November 2012, 07:33 AM

More or less you've correctly identified the piece...a brand of parang from the Northeast Malay Peninsula. The name is a bit more tricky though. First off the term "Parang Ginah" (which I think comes from Stone's or some other misguided and rather careless colonial ethnologist) is orthographically way off the mark. The locals have a variety of names for these including "parang Pattani" or "parang jenguk". The latter is probably the term from which the Parang Ginah name is probably derived. It is pronounced more like JERNG_ook...a Malay word which describes the rather curious shape of the blade and which translates more or less along the lines of the verb "to crane" as in ones's neck.

I put up a bunch of pictures of examples of these and there was some inconclusive discussion on them in a thread on the old UBB forum:

http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000598.html

I believe there are probably a variety of specific names for the different forms but I've never gotten around to explore these in more precise detail. I do remember a further discussion in Kelantan where it came out first off that these were multi-purpose fighting weapons that could serve as work knives, with the larger more elaborate ones more likely for show and the simpler heavier examples being of a more practical sort. Its said they were carried and worn unsheathed (thus the complete absence of scabbard examples...aside from the odd modern one off), with the handle tucked into the sarong or waistband and the blade jutting out to the front. It also appears given the large number of these and their relatively uniform age that these were something of a "fad" at some point probably in the mid to late-19th century but that carrying them went out of fashion probably not long after the imposition of British colonial hegemony. You do still see the occasional old codger using the heavy choper types like yours but most rural Malays in the area prefer the usual run of China (or other) made machete type blades which are cheap and plentiful in any local marketplace or hardware shop.

Robert · 21st November 2012, 01:37 AM

Hello DAHenkel, And thank you very much for all of the information on this parang and for the link to all of the great pictures. I am still a little confused on the proper name for this though, would it be "parang Pattani" or "parang jenguk" or does it really make a difference which one to call it? Another question would be if you would be comfortable with dating this piece? As it arrived today I have posted a few poor pictures taken inside of it after a light cleaning. I have not etched the blade as it still retains a lot of the original forge black finish from when it was made and I do not want to remove it. The blade shows very nice lamination that unfortunately does not show very well in the photos. The hilt is of what looks to be Kamagong wood and does have an age crack but none the less is very striking. This is a very heavy made piece and would produce horrendous injury to anyone unfortunate enough to be struck by it cleaving through bone and tissue with little effort. I do apologies for the poor picture quality.

Regards,
Robert

Robert · 21st November 2012, 05:51 AM

A couple of photos that show the steel collar between the blade and wood better.

Regards,
Robert

kai · 21st November 2012, 07:11 AM

Hello Robert,

Thanks for the pics - certainly much better than those from the seller!

Quote:

As it arrived today I have posted a few poor pictures taken inside of it after a light cleaning. I have not etched the blade as it still retains a lot of the original forge black finish from when it was made and I do not want to remove it. The blade shows very nice lamination that unfortunately does not show very well in the photos.

From the pics, I don't see clear signs for original forging scale - looks more like stabilised rust to me...

Maybe Dave could confirm wether examples with forging scale are known - I've always seen these neatly finished and would be surprised to hear of any traditional affectation appreciating any coarse (non-)finish.

Best wishes,
Kai

Robert · 21st November 2012, 07:39 AM

Hello Kai, Not forging scale, but a finish that is achieved by dipping the steel into oil and heating it to produce a smooth dark protective coating. The metal has a very smooth finish to it with no forge scale. The pictures do not show the color very well, it is a very deep blueish black. I only cleaned the surface rust off of the metal and there are still quite a few small spots of hard rust in small patches.

Regards,
Robert

Robert · 22nd November 2012, 02:19 AM

From DAHenkel earlier post on the old forum:

Quote:

I've also noted that I have not encountered antique pieces that have been kept sharp. This is not to say that they could not be sharpened but I rather doubt they were. The only sharp parang of this type I know of is a newly made one owned by Nik Rashidi. It is in form simmilar to the second parang shown (7th photo from the top). Rashidi is particularly fond of this parang and uses it especially for "belah kayu" that is, the process of roughing out wood billets for hilts and sheaths and also for butchering carcasses during Hari Raya Korban (muharram).

On this example the blade is sharp. Thought it is not so sharp that you could use it to shave it does still have a very definite edge. The strange thing is that starting from the blades tip the sharp edge only extends two thirds of the way back on the curve. Measuring back from the tip along the edge the sharpened area is only 5-1/2 inches in length. Not much of a cutting edge, about what you might expect to find on an average sized modern hatchet. Just for later reference, this piece weighs in at one pound twelve ounces and is eighteen inches in length measured in a straight line from the tip of the blade to the tip of the hilt.

Regards,
Robert

Robert · 26th November 2012, 02:36 AM

At nearly six hundred views there seems to be some definite interest in this piece. What is a problem for me is the fact that I cannot find much information on it on the web or in the few books that I possess. If anyone can point me in the right direction or has any information at all that hasn't already been posted please feel free to reply. A few of the main things that I would like to know about this item are an approximation of its age, whether or not the blade should be etched and exactly who used them. My thanks to everyone for their interest in this most interesting piece.

Regards,
Robert

21st November 2012, 01:37 AM	#3
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Hello DAHenkel, And thank you very much for all of the information on this parang and for the link to all of the great pictures. I am still a little confused on the proper name for this though, would it be "parang Pattani" or "parang jenguk" or does it really make a difference which one to call it? Another question would be if you would be comfortable with dating this piece? As it arrived today I have posted a few poor pictures taken inside of it after a light cleaning. I have not etched the blade as it still retains a lot of the original forge black finish from when it was made and I do not want to remove it. The blade shows very nice lamination that unfortunately does not show very well in the photos. The hilt is of what looks to be Kamagong wood and does have an age crack but none the less is very striking. This is a very heavy made piece and would produce horrendous injury to anyone unfortunate enough to be struck by it cleaving through bone and tissue with little effort. I do apologies for the poor picture quality. Regards, Robert Attached Images

21st November 2012, 05:51 AM	#4
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	A couple of photos that show the steel collar between the blade and wood better. Regards, Robert Attached Images

17th November 2012, 06:28 PM	#1
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Hello Detlef and thank you for your thoughts on this. As soon as it arrives I will clean the blade and might even do a light etch with vinegar to see what shows up before posting new pictures. By chance does any forum member have an example of a parang ginah like this that they might possibly post for comparison? Again, my thanks to everyone that has helped so far in identifying this piece. Regards, Robert

20th November 2012, 07:33 AM	#2
DAHenkel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 125	More or less you've correctly identified the piece...a brand of parang from the Northeast Malay Peninsula. The name is a bit more tricky though. First off the term "Parang Ginah" (which I think comes from Stone's or some other misguided and rather careless colonial ethnologist) is orthographically way off the mark. The locals have a variety of names for these including "parang Pattani" or "parang jenguk". The latter is probably the term from which the Parang Ginah name is probably derived. It is pronounced more like JERNG_ook...a Malay word which describes the rather curious shape of the blade and which translates more or less along the lines of the verb "to crane" as in ones's neck. I put up a bunch of pictures of examples of these and there was some inconclusive discussion on them in a thread on the old UBB forum: http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000598.html I believe there are probably a variety of specific names for the different forms but I've never gotten around to explore these in more precise detail. I do remember a further discussion in Kelantan where it came out first off that these were multi-purpose fighting weapons that could serve as work knives, with the larger more elaborate ones more likely for show and the simpler heavier examples being of a more practical sort. Its said they were carried and worn unsheathed (thus the complete absence of scabbard examples...aside from the odd modern one off), with the handle tucked into the sarong or waistband and the blade jutting out to the front. It also appears given the large number of these and their relatively uniform age that these were something of a "fad" at some point probably in the mid to late-19th century but that carrying them went out of fashion probably not long after the imposition of British colonial hegemony. You do still see the occasional old codger using the heavy choper types like yours but most rural Malays in the area prefer the usual run of China (or other) made machete type blades which are cheap and plentiful in any local marketplace or hardware shop.

21st November 2012, 07:39 AM	#6
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Hello Kai, Not forging scale, but a finish that is achieved by dipping the steel into oil and heating it to produce a smooth dark protective coating. The metal has a very smooth finish to it with no forge scale. The pictures do not show the color very well, it is a very deep blueish black. I only cleaned the surface rust off of the metal and there are still quite a few small spots of hard rust in small patches. Regards, Robert

26th November 2012, 02:36 AM	#8
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	At nearly six hundred views there seems to be some definite interest in this piece. What is a problem for me is the fact that I cannot find much information on it on the web or in the few books that I possess. If anyone can point me in the right direction or has any information at all that hasn't already been posted please feel free to reply. A few of the main things that I would like to know about this item are an approximation of its age, whether or not the blade should be etched and exactly who used them. My thanks to everyone for their interest in this most interesting piece. Regards, Robert