THE MARTINI HENRY.

[adrian]

Salaams Adrian ~ I'm determined to get into the conference ! Do you have any phone numbers to hand? Perhaps you may be able to PM me? It is interesting and I have just been given the inside info.
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

Hi Ibrahiim, yes I can give you contact numbers etc, please email me direct on adrian(at)stonehenge.com.au
Regards
Adrian

[Jim McDougall]

This is truly a fascinating and informative thread Ibrahiim, thank you!
While my focus has always been on swords, it is interesting and often surprising how much helpful data which pertains to them, even obtusely, can be gained from firearms production data.
I found a reference online "The Khyber Pass Martini" by Jason Atkin, apparantly a website with interesting data on these produced in Khyber Regions even into recent times by the Adam Khel and associated tribes in Khyber regions. I wonder how many of these would have been transported into Arabia, or would these have been strictly for local tribal use in Khyber areas?
Another interesting reference which might be helpful for research on this topic would be "The Lee-Enfield Story", Ian Skennerton, 1993.

Looking forward to learning more on these! and please keep us posted on outcome with museums and conference.

Shukran!
Jim

[rickystl]

Ibrahiim: Thank you for Posting. I really like these Arab decorated Martinis and Enfields. One day I will run across one for sale here in the States.

Kahnjar1: Every time I see your Martini and cartridge belt I keep asking myself: Why is that not at my house? What a fantastic set!! Rick.

[rickystl]

Ibrahiim: Forgot to mention......Thanks for the photos showing the rifle carry method. I've never seen this before. Most interesting.

I do own one Martini. It's a civilian sporter made by the Field Rifle Co. in Birmingham around 1895. It's in .303 British smokeless. Barrel marked: "Nitro Proofed". It shoots very well. I have my cartridges loaded to pre-WW1 specs. The sling is original to the gun.

Thanks again for posting. Rick.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by rickystl

Ibrahiim: Forgot to mention......Thanks for the photos showing the rifle carry method. I've never seen this before. Most interesting.

I do own one Martini. It's a civilian sporter made by the Field Rifle Co. in Birmingham around 1895. It's in .303 British smokeless. Barrel marked: "Nitro Proofed". It shoots very well. I have my cartridges loaded to pre-WW1 specs. The sling is original to the gun.

Thanks again for posting. Rick.

Salaams rickystl Your Enfield looks immaculate whereas mine has been dragged overland behind various camels Im afraid!!

I don't think yours is a civilian jopb since it has a bayonet lug...?

I looked down the inside of the barrel of mine (at #7 above) the other day and .. oh dear ...it needs a serious clean. You will find various stamps on the body including the usual Enfield Marks and a capital E over the end of the barrel over the breach. There is also a date. BSA Factory Mark.The Crown Mark; V.R. Various proof marks including on the falling block cocking lever etc. This has to be one of the shortest military rifles (and most powerful) ever made. I have put a photo of the ammo; Black powder 303. The weapon was so short that no modifications were needed for use by the smaller statured Arab end users where they even retained all the woodwork and the bayonet lug, though, the blades themselves were discarded.
Photos show the E mark and original Ammo in belt compared to Lee Enfield 303 ammo(above)which arrived shortly after with the famous, new, magazine fed, Lee Enfield SMLE ..thus making this a redundant weapon available therefor to the various guard units and civilian use throughout the East.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

This is truly a fascinating and informative thread Ibrahiim, thank you!
While my focus has always been on swords, it is interesting and often surprising how much helpful data which pertains to them, even obtusely, can be gained from firearms production data.
I found a reference online "The Khyber Pass Martini" by Jason Atkin, apparantly a website with interesting data on these produced in Khyber Regions even into recent times by the Adam Khel and associated tribes in Khyber regions. I wonder how many of these would have been transported into Arabia, or would these have been strictly for local tribal use in Khyber areas?
Another interesting reference which might be helpful for research on this topic would be "The Lee-Enfield Story", Ian Skennerton, 1993.

Looking forward to learning more on these! and please keep us posted on outcome with museums and conference.

Shukran!
Jim

Salaams Jim ~ Thank you for your post. I have noted the important references and will look them up. As it happens there are a couple of Khyber chaps only across the street from us. They work in a small weapons workshop refitting woodwork and repairing old rifles including abu futtila. Its true that we tend to link the manufacture of these weapons to Afghan sources but everyone forgets the other side of the mountains in and around the Khyber Pass and Peshawar regions where there were dozens of workshops making stuff. Some of the locally made long guns could out shoot and out range the British in the 19th C ; most notably in the battle with the 44TH Regiment of Foot. For sure Afghan/Khyber manufactured weapons leached out around the adjoining regions and as far as here and Yemen however they are easier to spot and often had mistakes on the spelling but there are several that pass muster and some which are as good as or even better looking than originals!

The normal dead give away of the trigger guard being flimsy looking as on other long guns doesn't apply to the Khyber made Martini Henry simply because those parts were obtainable from other bastardized weapons and from imported parts. If the main body could be knocked up it would be a simple matter to add the other bits and pieces. How they made the barrels, however, is beyond me !

What I find poignant regarding gunpowder weaponry is that it is inside this timezone that so much changed regarding blades. Indeed the fog caused by these guns hides the demise of many a hand held weapon including the spear, sword and bow. The spear (probably the most important Arab weapon) virtually fell off the map as it was essentially superceded and couldn't be iconized as it was too clumsy whilst the bow and arrow vanished... despite the fact that it was faster than the gun and remained so until the discovery of the magazine fed rifle after 1900. Gunpowder weaponry mainly through the advent of rifle and cannon points to the demise of the Omani Battle Sword and could be responsible for the green light being given for the long flexible Omani dancing sword in about 1744 / 1800. (A date I defensively place as initially the Busaidi dynasty start date; 1744)

The gun in the Rifle configuration therefor has a lot to answer for (Pistols never really took off here) The Rifle on the other hand filled the role of spear and bow and for hunting was excellent whilst it was also devastating at closer ranges and thus largely retired the sword (but not always)

Both the dagger and sword have retained a "traditional place" within Arab society as "badges of office" and "head of the family"status symbols.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Note To Forum Mutrah Souk Guns; 1 Nov 2012.
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Salaams All ~ The idea originally was to have Martini Henrys right the way around my dining room... I need a few more !
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[RhysMichael]

From Theiger Vol 5 I think it is a Martini

[RhysMichael]

This may be one also