New Keris/Keris baru

A. G. Maisey · 28th June 2012, 11:41 PM

I don't think that we can use comparisons of attitudes to other weaponry to try to find similarities with the keris. A newly made keris can still be authentic, but it depends upon the aspect under consideration. It is even possible for a newly made keris to be regarded in the same, or similar light to a pusaka keris, if that newly made keris has incorporated a part of a pusaka keris into its forging, or if the essence of a missing pusaka keris is called into its newly made vessel. This is perhaps what happened with the pusakas that disappeared after the sacking of Kartosuro and then reappeared again in Surakarta some years later.

When we set out to collect, or to study, the keris, there are at least two different roads that we can take:- we can simply collect and focus on the object itself, or we can attempt to understand the object. To understand the object we probably need to gain at least a minimal understanding of the culture surrounding it. However, if we progress past that level of minimal understanding it is possible that we may find that our rational Western mind is in fact no more rational than the mind of the people who are a part of keris culture.

Our Western rationality has developed within the framework of our society, and within that framework it is realistic to accept that the way we think and reason is rational. However, our Western rationality is to a large degree irrational and thus non-functional in a society that is based upon different precepts and concepts.

Some of the values that apply to the keris also apply to other Indonesian weaponry, however, the keris is unique in its position as a societal icon.

Bjorn · 9th October 2013, 09:03 PM

Just to revive this thread on keris kemardikan I'd like to share a photo I came across on Toni Junus' Facebook page.

This keris won the SNKI Keris Award for The World in 2010.

Name: Kanjeng Kyai Singa Kura
Dhapur: Singa Kura Bener
Pamor: Jarot Asem

My main attraction to this keris is due to its slender shape and intriguing pamor, which is at the same time simple and complex. I think I would have liked the blade better without the singa-kura gandik, but that's personal preference. Does anyone know if there is any symbolism behind the lion-tortoise combo or is it just for show?

Hopefully other members will have more interesting modern keris to share.

shadejoy · 29th October 2014, 12:54 AM

Unfortunately I can't give any insights on what the animal characters represent or symbolize. But I agree, beautiful pamor and a complex one at that. A Balinese Empu (Pande) recently finished creating a Keris with this fine pamor on my request. I couldn't be happier.

A. G. Maisey · 29th October 2014, 02:37 AM

A Balinese pande made a keris with this pamor?

Incredible!

The lion-tortoise on the keris shown is purely for artistic ornamentation, however if interpreted in older representations, the lion can be associated in Hindu belief with warriors, in Chinese belief they are a protective motif.

Prajapati, the First Being became a tortoise to have a child, and he supports the universe. I think that the elements of the universe also are carried by his body --- not certain on this.

Later, Wisnu became a tortoise (Second Incarnation) so his shell could support Mount Mandhara.

Both these motifs are loaded with symbolism, its just a matter of how they are interpreted.

shadejoy · 29th October 2014, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

A Balinese pande made a keris with this pamor?

Interesting interpretation.

Yes, Pande Made Gde Suardika.

It took a little over 11 months and as strange as it may sound (..or careless, depends on how you look at it) never once did I ever communicate with him in person during the time.

I very much agree in one of the old threads implying that Kamardikan Kerises seldom get much appreciation as what they truly deserve compare to old Kerises.

A. G. Maisey · 29th October 2014, 01:40 PM

So Shadejoy, this keris that you have shown us is the product of Pande Made Gde Suardika ?

Superb work, and an immense advance upon the work that I have previously seen attributed to this maker. Truly incredible.

Thank you very much for permitting us to see this keris.

shadejoy · 29th October 2014, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

So Shadejoy, this keris that you have shown us is the product of Pande Made Gde Suardika ?

That is correct.

Are you implying that you've seen his past work(s)? You make me real curious. I'd greatly appreciate it if you could share any documentations.

To be frank, I had never seen his work before. All things that lead me to him were just some articles and pages I came across courtesy of the big world wide web.

The other reason was because I was so disappointed of an Empu from Imogiri, Yogyakarta (I'm pretty sure I mentioned him in my old posting). He originally took my request but communication was so horrible and I had to end it. Strangely enough, I think you had forewarned me about doing any deals with Javanese which I didn't take it too seriously back then.

Anyhow, I am lucky to have known Bli Pande (Pande Made Gde Suardika) and think of him nothing but high regards.

One of the pics was taken during recent Tumpek Landep day on Oct 18, 2014 right before he sent me the Keris.

9th October 2013, 09:03 PM	#2
Bjorn Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 188	Just to revive this thread on keris kemardikan I'd like to share a photo I came across on Toni Junus' Facebook page. This keris won the SNKI Keris Award for The World in 2010. Name: Kanjeng Kyai Singa Kura Dhapur: Singa Kura Bener Pamor: Jarot Asem My main attraction to this keris is due to its slender shape and intriguing pamor, which is at the same time simple and complex. I think I would have liked the blade better without the singa-kura gandik, but that's personal preference. Does anyone know if there is any symbolism behind the lion-tortoise combo or is it just for show? Hopefully other members will have more interesting modern keris to share. Attached Images

28th June 2012, 11:41 PM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	I don't think that we can use comparisons of attitudes to other weaponry to try to find similarities with the keris. A newly made keris can still be authentic, but it depends upon the aspect under consideration. It is even possible for a newly made keris to be regarded in the same, or similar light to a pusaka keris, if that newly made keris has incorporated a part of a pusaka keris into its forging, or if the essence of a missing pusaka keris is called into its newly made vessel. This is perhaps what happened with the pusakas that disappeared after the sacking of Kartosuro and then reappeared again in Surakarta some years later. When we set out to collect, or to study, the keris, there are at least two different roads that we can take:- we can simply collect and focus on the object itself, or we can attempt to understand the object. To understand the object we probably need to gain at least a minimal understanding of the culture surrounding it. However, if we progress past that level of minimal understanding it is possible that we may find that our rational Western mind is in fact no more rational than the mind of the people who are a part of keris culture. Our Western rationality has developed within the framework of our society, and within that framework it is realistic to accept that the way we think and reason is rational. However, our Western rationality is to a large degree irrational and thus non-functional in a society that is based upon different precepts and concepts. Some of the values that apply to the keris also apply to other Indonesian weaponry, however, the keris is unique in its position as a societal icon.

29th October 2014, 12:54 AM	#3
shadejoy Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: Massachusetts, US Posts: 67	Unfortunately I can't give any insights on what the animal characters represent or symbolize. But I agree, beautiful pamor and a complex one at that. A Balinese Empu (Pande) recently finished creating a Keris with this fine pamor on my request. I couldn't be happier.

29th October 2014, 02:37 AM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	A Balinese pande made a keris with this pamor? Incredible! The lion-tortoise on the keris shown is purely for artistic ornamentation, however if interpreted in older representations, the lion can be associated in Hindu belief with warriors, in Chinese belief they are a protective motif. Prajapati, the First Being became a tortoise to have a child, and he supports the universe. I think that the elements of the universe also are carried by his body --- not certain on this. Later, Wisnu became a tortoise (Second Incarnation) so his shell could support Mount Mandhara. Both these motifs are loaded with symbolism, its just a matter of how they are interpreted.

29th October 2014, 01:40 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	So Shadejoy, this keris that you have shown us is the product of Pande Made Gde Suardika ? Superb work, and an immense advance upon the work that I have previously seen attributed to this maker. Truly incredible. Thank you very much for permitting us to see this keris.