FORMING HOT METAL WITH BARE HANDS

Karttikeya · 14th March 2012, 10:36 AM

Genuine paper thin blades with finger pressure markings or what we call Sombro nowadays should have 9 finger pressure marking, no more no less. Most of blades are supposed as tangguh Segaluh and Pajajaran have 9 luk, I myself do not know why should be 9, Anybody know about it? I share some photos of keris Puthut with 9 finger pressure markings. Indentation from pressure markings occured on every pamor wulan-wulan and also Puthut figure seems very artistic, it was as though the pamor gives the detail appearance of Puthut itself.

David · 14th March 2012, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karttikeya

Genuine paper thin blades with finger pressure markings or what we call Sombro nowadays should have 9 finger pressure marking, no more no less. Most of blades are supposed as tangguh Segaluh and Pajajaran have 9 luk, I myself do not know why should be 9, Anybody know about it? I share some photos of keris Puthut with 9 finger pressure markings. Indentation from pressure markings occured on every pamor wulan-wulan and also Puthut figure seems very artistic, it was as though the pamor gives the detail appearance of Puthut itself.

Interesting keris Karttikeya. I am somewhat confused by you use of terminology. I have never heard this type of keris called "puthut". AFAIK that term is reserved for keris where the figure is at the gandik, not the hilt. I would probably call this a keris sajen or perhaps simply a talismanic keris. Also, AFAIK, not all keris Sombro display pijit, finger indentations. They also do not have an integral figural iron hilt like your example. I am also confused about your claim that "genuine" keris pijit all have 9 indentation marks. I have at least two examples which i would consider to be genuine. One is a what i know as a keris puthut, the other is what i know as a keris Sombro. The Puthut has 5 indentations, the Sombro has 3. I cannot see the indentations on the photo of your example due to the angle of your shot. I have a hard time, though, picturing 9 indentations on what are generally very short blades.

A. G. Maisey · 14th March 2012, 07:40 PM

Well Karttikeya, that's something new I've learnt!

I rather think a lot of people don't know this information.

Boedhi Adhitya · 15th March 2012, 07:19 AM

David,
I understand your confusion. In the old days this kind of keris would be called "keris sajen" or "keris majapahit", but I reckon recently a new terminology arise and call it as "puthut sajen" or "puthut" in sort, due to it's figural, one piece handle. Another term is "puthut cundrik" to call this kind of keris with dhapur cundrik (a kind of pedhang suduk shape). Sometimes it's confused with sombro.

An 'old school boy' like you may get "lost in terminology" nowdays in Java keris world

regards,

Boedhi Adhitya

A. G. Maisey · 15th March 2012, 08:22 AM

Good to see you back Boedhi.

In the Land of Oz now?

You're right about current keris terminology. One highly respected Solo empu, now retired, remarked to me a couple of years ago:- "where do they get all these names from? I've never heard of them!"

It is absolutely certain that the new generation of Javanese keris fanciers have been busy producing their own lexicon for some time now. If the people I learnt from in the 1970's and 1980's were still alive, they would be just as confused as many of us older people are.

David · 15th March 2012, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boedhi Adhitya

An 'old school boy' like you may get "lost in terminology" nowdays in Java keris world

Hi Boedhi, nice to read you again.

This is undoubtable true and i certainly make no claims to be up on the latest keris lingo in the Jawa keris world. Not sure that is really possible from half way around the world though.

So if the above type of keris is nowadays referred to as Puthut Sajen, so be it. I am curious what the actual meaning of the word "puthut" is. Can anyone assist there. I have always understood it as a praying figure while i have looked upon the sajen hilts as ancestral figures, which may or may not be the same thing.

Still, i am doubtful that even the current keris world in Jawa would call Karttikeya's keris a Sombro, would they? And i still question that a keris pijit need have 9 indentations to be considered genuine.

14th March 2012, 10:36 AM	#1
Karttikeya Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 54	Genuine paper thin blades with finger pressure markings or what we call Sombro nowadays should have 9 finger pressure marking, no more no less. Most of blades are supposed as tangguh Segaluh and Pajajaran have 9 luk, I myself do not know why should be 9, Anybody know about it? I share some photos of keris Puthut with 9 finger pressure markings. Indentation from pressure markings occured on every pamor wulan-wulan and also Puthut figure seems very artistic, it was as though the pamor gives the detail appearance of Puthut itself. Attached Images

14th March 2012, 07:40 PM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Well Karttikeya, that's something new I've learnt! I rather think a lot of people don't know this information.

15th March 2012, 07:19 AM	#4
Boedhi Adhitya Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 103	David, I understand your confusion. In the old days this kind of keris would be called "keris sajen" or "keris majapahit", but I reckon recently a new terminology arise and call it as "puthut sajen" or "puthut" in sort, due to it's figural, one piece handle. Another term is "puthut cundrik" to call this kind of keris with dhapur cundrik (a kind of pedhang suduk shape). Sometimes it's confused with sombro. An 'old school boy' like you may get "lost in terminology" nowdays in Java keris world regards, Boedhi Adhitya

15th March 2012, 08:22 AM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Good to see you back Boedhi. In the Land of Oz now? You're right about current keris terminology. One highly respected Solo empu, now retired, remarked to me a couple of years ago:- "where do they get all these names from? I've never heard of them!" It is absolutely certain that the new generation of Javanese keris fanciers have been busy producing their own lexicon for some time now. If the people I learnt from in the 1970's and 1980's were still alive, they would be just as confused as many of us older people are.