Wilah from?

Harley · 7th December 2011, 08:39 PM

Hi Detlef,

I have been looking at the link you placed, but that is a real eye cacher

Especially the blade after the warangan, very, very nice!

regards,
Ben

A. G. Maisey · 7th December 2011, 09:04 PM

As advised in my post #35, the old style of blade fit was to sit the gonjo proud of the atasan; the more usual fit is to sit the gonjo level with the atasan.

My own observations tend to indicate that in the olden times keris of the aristocracy were mounted in what has been identified as the old way, whilst the keris of commoners were mounted with the gonjo level with the top of the atasan.

I have in my possession a keris that was once the property of the Raja of Badung. This keris was probably mounted to this wrongko in the second half of the 19th century. At its edge, the center of the gonjo sits 4mm above the top of the gonjo.

Jussi M. · 8th December 2011, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

(...) the old style of blade fit was to sit the gonjo proud of the atasan; the more usual fit is to sit the gonjo level with the atasan.

My own observations tend to indicate that in the olden times keris of the aristocracy were mounted in what has been identified as the old way, whilst the keris of commoners were mounted with the gonjo level with the top of the atasan.

Kinatah?

Awesome work by the way

Thanks,

J.

Harley · 8th December 2011, 09:32 PM

I am trying to make a new hilt, i don't know what the name of this type is,
but i think if you see the picture you no what i mean

Later on i put some rope around it, but for now i hope you can give me advice, cause i can't make out of he's to big or not.

regards,
Ben

A. G. Maisey · 8th December 2011, 11:58 PM

Ben, what you have at the moment is similar to a cenangan hilt, however, the two little raised sections internal to the pommel and the cap section at the lower end don't really have a place in cenangan patterns that I have seen.

If you wrap this with twine, it will become a loncengan

Here is a pic of a loncengan, probably more usual in Lombok than in Bali.

Proportion is within acceptable parameters, but it is possible that a little shorter might be better, however, it is also possible that the photo is lying to me.

Harley · 9th December 2011, 12:25 AM

The one in the picture(loncengan) is the same as i was trying to make, the raised sections where there to stop the rope/twine?
I couldn't decide if it was right hight, and if you doubt that it's a little to big, it probably is, i think it's about 12 cm.
But now i know that is more common in Lombok i must decide if this is the right hilt for this keris, it's a pity i like the shape.
Thanks again Mr Maisey!

regards,
Ben

A. G. Maisey · 9th December 2011, 02:03 AM

Harley, with the size of a hilt, its a matter of proportion, not measurable height --- well, at least with Bali keris it is, because with Bali keris the size of the wrongko can vary quite a lot, with Jawa keris the sizes and consequently the proportions are very much more disciplined.

I can't be certain if the hilt is a whisker too long or not, because a very slight difference in the angle of the photo can make a difference in the perceived proportion. I wouldn't alter the proportion, were I you, its within acceptable parameters.

Do you have any images of a cenangan that you can copy? What you have produced is already very close.

8th December 2011, 09:32 PM	#4
Harley Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Nederland Posts: 83	I am trying to make a new hilt, i don't know what the name of this type is, but i think if you see the picture you no what i mean Later on i put some rope around it, but for now i hope you can give me advice, cause i can't make out of he's to big or not. regards, Ben Attached Images

8th December 2011, 11:58 PM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,013	Ben, what you have at the moment is similar to a cenangan hilt, however, the two little raised sections internal to the pommel and the cap section at the lower end don't really have a place in cenangan patterns that I have seen. If you wrap this with twine, it will become a loncengan Here is a pic of a loncengan, probably more usual in Lombok than in Bali. Proportion is within acceptable parameters, but it is possible that a little shorter might be better, however, it is also possible that the photo is lying to me. Attached Images

7th December 2011, 08:39 PM	#1
Harley Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Nederland Posts: 83	Hi Detlef, I have been looking at the link you placed, but that is a real eye cacher Especially the blade after the warangan, very, very nice! regards, Ben

7th December 2011, 09:04 PM	#2
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,013	As advised in my post #35, the old style of blade fit was to sit the gonjo proud of the atasan; the more usual fit is to sit the gonjo level with the atasan. My own observations tend to indicate that in the olden times keris of the aristocracy were mounted in what has been identified as the old way, whilst the keris of commoners were mounted with the gonjo level with the top of the atasan. I have in my possession a keris that was once the property of the Raja of Badung. This keris was probably mounted to this wrongko in the second half of the 19th century. At its edge, the center of the gonjo sits 4mm above the top of the gonjo.

9th December 2011, 12:25 AM	#6
Harley Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Nederland Posts: 83	The one in the picture(loncengan) is the same as i was trying to make, the raised sections where there to stop the rope/twine? I couldn't decide if it was right hight, and if you doubt that it's a little to big, it probably is, i think it's about 12 cm. But now i know that is more common in Lombok i must decide if this is the right hilt for this keris, it's a pity i like the shape. Thanks again Mr Maisey! regards, Ben

9th December 2011, 02:03 AM	#7
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,013	Harley, with the size of a hilt, its a matter of proportion, not measurable height --- well, at least with Bali keris it is, because with Bali keris the size of the wrongko can vary quite a lot, with Jawa keris the sizes and consequently the proportions are very much more disciplined. I can't be certain if the hilt is a whisker too long or not, because a very slight difference in the angle of the photo can make a difference in the perceived proportion. I wouldn't alter the proportion, were I you, its within acceptable parameters. Do you have any images of a cenangan that you can copy? What you have produced is already very close.