EASTER ISLAND CLUBS

katana · 20th August 2011, 04:58 PM

Hi Fearn,
you are correct.... climatic, archaeological and oceanic studies all support the distribution of oceanic peoples spreading Westerly from Australasia. The prevailing winds and currents are predominately westerly at this latitude and these forces are intensified when El Nino occurs every 2 - 7 years. Bearing in mind the small canoes used and some of the great distances travelled, often blindly, as many islands could not be seen on the horizon, as they island hopped ....they were incredibly brave or desperate to find new lands. The speed of travel was incredibly enhanced when El Nino struck and there is evidence to support an increase activity in the Westerly movement at such times.

All the best
David

fearn · 20th August 2011, 05:25 PM

Hi David,

I'm not even sure about the poor quality of some of those boats. As a demonstration, a group of Pacific Islanders built seven vakas and set out from Auckland, New Zealand this April. They sailed to Hawaii, predominantly using traditional navigation techniques. Then they sailed to San Francisco, and currently (8/20/11) they're sailing south off Venice Beach. They'll end in the Solomon Islands next July. That's crossing the Pacific twice in 18 months. Not too shabby.

Here's The Vaka Moana website, which chronicles their voyage.

While traveling through the modern Pacific is a great deal easier than it was 1000 years ago, I think we under-rate both Polynesian boats and sailing skills. Even finding unknown islands isn't a blind shot: when you see land birds take off into the open ocean, you know they're heading for other land somewhere. That's how the existence of New Zealand (and Hawaii) was inferred.

Best,

F

Battara · 20th August 2011, 07:32 PM

Nice posting Fearn and on the money as far as Easter Island research is concerned.

katana · 20th August 2011, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fearn

Hi David,

While traveling through the modern Pacific is a great deal easier than it was 1000 years ago, I think we under-rate both Polynesian boats and sailing skills. Even finding unknown islands isn't a blind shot: when you see land birds take off into the open ocean, you know they're heading for other land somewhere. That's how the existence of New Zealand (and Hawaii) was inferred.

Best,

F

Hi Fearn,
I suppose I should have said 'relatively' small canoes ....travelling long distances the canoe occupants would need plenty of water and food. Also, tools and weapons to support them once they made land. These provisions would soon fill a canoe. Obviously navagation skills are extremely useful when you have a destination. The earlier 'trailblazers' did not have this luxury or the definate knowledge that they would find land.
I agree that in general following 'land' birds might lead you to land ....but it is far from fail safe. Some birds have been known to stay on the wing for considerable distances. The non-stop migratory flight of the goodwit is over 6000 miles....much over water. Admittedly they are waders ...but are from the oceanic area.
Rapa Nui is indeed interesting from a number of view-points ....including the ecological disaster they created for themselves ....but we are digressing from the original post, sorry.

Regards David

"...The routes of satellite tagged Bar-tailed Godwits migrating north from New Zealand. This species has the longest known non-stop migration of any species, up to 10,200 km (6,300 mi)........."

tom hyle · 20th August 2011, 10:31 PM

AFAIK the big cargo/transport ships were catamarans rather than canoes; considerably more carrying capacity.

fearn · 23rd August 2011, 02:00 AM

Hi Tom,

There were some big outriggers out there as well. An example is the Fijian ndrua or Marshallese Walap.

Still, your point is well taken. The longest voyages were almost certainly in double-hulled Polynesian Vakas, of about that size, and they do carry a quite a lot.

The biggest issue Polynesian "canoes" face is that we call them canoes, not ships, even though they were multi-hulled, multi-planked, deep-ocean boats that (in the cases above) couldn't be paddled easily or at all.

Best,

F

VANDOO · 21st July 2013, 04:46 PM

WHILE WE KNOW POLYNESIANS MADE MANY LONG OCEAN VOYAGES WE HAVE LITTLE UNDERSTANDING OF HOW THEY NAVIGATED OR PICKED A DIRECTION TO GO. MANY A THEORY ABOUNDS AND MANY OR ALL SURELY PLAYED A PART IN THEIR SUCESS BUT WE MAY NOT HAVE THE FULL PICTURE.
MANY VOYAGES MAY HAVE ENDED IN DESTRUCTION AS TIMING AND LUCK PLAY A PART IN LONG SEA VOYAGES. BUT THE SAILING AND NAVAGATION KNOWLEGE OF THE POLYNESIANS MAY HAVE BEEN MUCH BETTER THAN WE KNOW AND DISASTERS KEPT TO A MINIMUM.
THEY LIVED CLOSE TO NATURE AND STUDIED THE WILDLIFE, WAVES, WINDS,SEASONS,CLOUDS, CURRENTS AS WELL AS WHAT WASHED UP ON THEIR ISLANDS AND WHERE THE CURRENTS THAT BROUGHT STUFF CAME FROM. THEY KNEW THE ESTABLISHED ROUTES FROM ISLAND TO ISLAND AND WHEN AND HOW BEST TO VOYAGE TO THEM. NATURE OFFERS MANY CLUES TO THOSE WHO STUDY AND LEARN TO UNDERSTAND THEM ALL SOCIETYS WHO SAILED KNEW THE SEASONS OF STORMS AND THOSE OF GOOD WINDS AND CURRENTS.
THERE IS ALSO THE SHAMAN OR PRIESTS WHO OFTEN HAD VISIONS. THERE ARE MANY TALES IN MANY CULTURES OF THE ABILITY TO SEE FAR AWAY OR EVEN INTO THE FUTURE. THESE PEOPLE WERE ALWAYS CONSULTED BEFORE ANY LARGE AND IMPORTANT EVENT SO THEIR IMPUT WAS PART OF THE SUCESS OR FAILURE OF THE VOYAGE. I DON'T HAVE THESE ABILITYS AND HAVE NOT BEEN SCHOOLED BY THOSE WHO SAY THEY DO AND HAVEN'T TAKEN ANY OF THE DRUGS OFTEN USED IN SUCH TRANCES SO DON'T COUNT THEM FOR MUCH. BUT I HAVE SEEN ENOUGH STRANGE THINGS NOT TO DISCOUNT THEM ENTIRELY AND MOST OF THAT KNOWLEGE HAS BEEN LOST AS MAN MOVES FARTHER FROM NATURE.

VANDOO · 22nd August 2015, 06:30 PM

HERE ARE A FEW EXAMPLES OF THIS RAPA NUI CLUB FORM. UNFORTUNATELY I HAVE VERY LITTLE INFORMATION ON THEM OTHER THAN THAT THEY ARE FROM EASTER ISLAND. I BOUGHT ONE IN 1974 AND IT WAS 17 INCHES LONG, OLD AND THE WOOD WAS COATED IN SOME BLACK STAIN WHICH WAS SHOWING WEAR. I HAVE SEEN OTHER EXAMPLES DESCRIBED AS MID 20TH CENTURY AND CIRCA 1960. MOST LIKELY MADE FOR TOURISTS BUT IT IS POSSIBLE THEY ARE REPLICAS OF REAL ARTIFACTS AS ARE MANY OF THE OTHER WOOD CARVINGS FROM EASTER ISLAND. I WOULD GUESS THEY WERE FOR CEREMONY'S OR TO REPRESENT STATUS AS THEY WOULD NOT MAKE A GOOD WEAPON. I THINK THEY ARE WORTHY OF A EASTER ISLAND COLLECTION AS THERE IS NOT A WIDE RANGE OF ITEMS AVAILABLE FROM THERE. PERHAPS THERE IS A COLLECTOR WITH GOOD REFERENCES OR INFORMATION ON EASTER ISLAND WHO CAN FILL US IN.
#1. MY CLUB 17 IN LONG
#2.& #3. SAID TO BE MID 20TH. CENTURY, 34 X 8 CM.
#4. SAID TO BE FROM THE 1940'S
#5. SAID TO BE CIRCA 1960
#6 & #7 A EXAMPLE FROM ANOTHER MEMBERS POST ,THESE PICTURES APPEAR AT THE TOP. SORRY FOR THE CONFUSION AS I ATTEMPTED TO TRANSFER THE INFO FROM ANOTHER POST AND THE PICTURES DID NOT COME WITH IT. I AM ADDING THIS HERE TO ADD TO THE REFERENCE.
Attached Images #8. 13 IN. SHORT CLUB

20th August 2011, 04:58 PM	#1
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Hi Fearn, you are correct.... climatic, archaeological and oceanic studies all support the distribution of oceanic peoples spreading Westerly from Australasia. The prevailing winds and currents are predominately westerly at this latitude and these forces are intensified when El Nino occurs every 2 - 7 years. Bearing in mind the small canoes used and some of the great distances travelled, often blindly, as many islands could not be seen on the horizon, as they island hopped ....they were incredibly brave or desperate to find new lands. The speed of travel was incredibly enhanced when El Nino struck and there is evidence to support an increase activity in the Westerly movement at such times. All the best David

20th August 2011, 05:25 PM	#2
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Hi David, I'm not even sure about the poor quality of some of those boats. As a demonstration, a group of Pacific Islanders built seven vakas and set out from Auckland, New Zealand this April. They sailed to Hawaii, predominantly using traditional navigation techniques. Then they sailed to San Francisco, and currently (8/20/11) they're sailing south off Venice Beach. They'll end in the Solomon Islands next July. That's crossing the Pacific twice in 18 months. Not too shabby. Here's The Vaka Moana website, which chronicles their voyage. While traveling through the modern Pacific is a great deal easier than it was 1000 years ago, I think we under-rate both Polynesian boats and sailing skills. Even finding unknown islands isn't a blind shot: when you see land birds take off into the open ocean, you know they're heading for other land somewhere. That's how the existence of New Zealand (and Hawaii) was inferred. Best, F

20th August 2011, 07:32 PM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,280	Nice posting Fearn and on the money as far as Easter Island research is concerned.

20th August 2011, 10:31 PM	#5
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	AFAIK the big cargo/transport ships were catamarans rather than canoes; considerably more carrying capacity.

23rd August 2011, 02:00 AM	#6
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Hi Tom, There were some big outriggers out there as well. An example is the Fijian ndrua or Marshallese Walap. Still, your point is well taken. The longest voyages were almost certainly in double-hulled Polynesian Vakas, of about that size, and they do carry a quite a lot. The biggest issue Polynesian "canoes" face is that we call them canoes, not ships, even though they were multi-hulled, multi-planked, deep-ocean boats that (in the cases above) couldn't be paddled easily or at all. Best, F

21st July 2013, 04:46 PM	#7
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	WHILE WE KNOW POLYNESIANS MADE MANY LONG OCEAN VOYAGES WE HAVE LITTLE UNDERSTANDING OF HOW THEY NAVIGATED OR PICKED A DIRECTION TO GO. MANY A THEORY ABOUNDS AND MANY OR ALL SURELY PLAYED A PART IN THEIR SUCESS BUT WE MAY NOT HAVE THE FULL PICTURE. MANY VOYAGES MAY HAVE ENDED IN DESTRUCTION AS TIMING AND LUCK PLAY A PART IN LONG SEA VOYAGES. BUT THE SAILING AND NAVAGATION KNOWLEGE OF THE POLYNESIANS MAY HAVE BEEN MUCH BETTER THAN WE KNOW AND DISASTERS KEPT TO A MINIMUM. THEY LIVED CLOSE TO NATURE AND STUDIED THE WILDLIFE, WAVES, WINDS,SEASONS,CLOUDS, CURRENTS AS WELL AS WHAT WASHED UP ON THEIR ISLANDS AND WHERE THE CURRENTS THAT BROUGHT STUFF CAME FROM. THEY KNEW THE ESTABLISHED ROUTES FROM ISLAND TO ISLAND AND WHEN AND HOW BEST TO VOYAGE TO THEM. NATURE OFFERS MANY CLUES TO THOSE WHO STUDY AND LEARN TO UNDERSTAND THEM ALL SOCIETYS WHO SAILED KNEW THE SEASONS OF STORMS AND THOSE OF GOOD WINDS AND CURRENTS. THERE IS ALSO THE SHAMAN OR PRIESTS WHO OFTEN HAD VISIONS. THERE ARE MANY TALES IN MANY CULTURES OF THE ABILITY TO SEE FAR AWAY OR EVEN INTO THE FUTURE. THESE PEOPLE WERE ALWAYS CONSULTED BEFORE ANY LARGE AND IMPORTANT EVENT SO THEIR IMPUT WAS PART OF THE SUCESS OR FAILURE OF THE VOYAGE. I DON'T HAVE THESE ABILITYS AND HAVE NOT BEEN SCHOOLED BY THOSE WHO SAY THEY DO AND HAVEN'T TAKEN ANY OF THE DRUGS OFTEN USED IN SUCH TRANCES SO DON'T COUNT THEM FOR MUCH. BUT I HAVE SEEN ENOUGH STRANGE THINGS NOT TO DISCOUNT THEM ENTIRELY AND MOST OF THAT KNOWLEGE HAS BEEN LOST AS MAN MOVES FARTHER FROM NATURE.

22nd August 2015, 06:30 PM	#8
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	HERE ARE A FEW EXAMPLES OF THIS RAPA NUI CLUB FORM. UNFORTUNATELY I HAVE VERY LITTLE INFORMATION ON THEM OTHER THAN THAT THEY ARE FROM EASTER ISLAND. I BOUGHT ONE IN 1974 AND IT WAS 17 INCHES LONG, OLD AND THE WOOD WAS COATED IN SOME BLACK STAIN WHICH WAS SHOWING WEAR. I HAVE SEEN OTHER EXAMPLES DESCRIBED AS MID 20TH CENTURY AND CIRCA 1960. MOST LIKELY MADE FOR TOURISTS BUT IT IS POSSIBLE THEY ARE REPLICAS OF REAL ARTIFACTS AS ARE MANY OF THE OTHER WOOD CARVINGS FROM EASTER ISLAND. I WOULD GUESS THEY WERE FOR CEREMONY'S OR TO REPRESENT STATUS AS THEY WOULD NOT MAKE A GOOD WEAPON. I THINK THEY ARE WORTHY OF A EASTER ISLAND COLLECTION AS THERE IS NOT A WIDE RANGE OF ITEMS AVAILABLE FROM THERE. PERHAPS THERE IS A COLLECTOR WITH GOOD REFERENCES OR INFORMATION ON EASTER ISLAND WHO CAN FILL US IN. #1. MY CLUB 17 IN LONG #2.& #3. SAID TO BE MID 20TH. CENTURY, 34 X 8 CM. #4. SAID TO BE FROM THE 1940'S #5. SAID TO BE CIRCA 1960 #6 & #7 A EXAMPLE FROM ANOTHER MEMBERS POST ,THESE PICTURES APPEAR AT THE TOP. SORRY FOR THE CONFUSION AS I ATTEMPTED TO TRANSFER THE INFO FROM ANOTHER POST AND THE PICTURES DID NOT COME WITH IT. I AM ADDING THIS HERE TO ADD TO THE REFERENCE. Attached Images #8. 13 IN. SHORT CLUB Attached Images Last edited by VANDOO; 22nd August 2015 at 07:43 PM.