Encounters of the Third Kind

BluErf · 4th December 2010, 02:29 AM

Not just Sumatra, but also in N. Peninsula (see silver coteng pic at the bottom), but the thing is that the form of the motif is not the same. In Sumatra/N Peninsula, the motif is fatter/rounder. Anyway, the hilt Alan posted has a style that does not seem to be from the Sumatra/Malay side of the Archipelago, but more of the rounder, more naturalistic forms I thought is usually found on the western side of the archipelago. Ok, this is my guess, but let's see how far off I am.

A. G. Maisey · 4th December 2010, 03:45 AM

Yes, its a representation of the tumpal motif.

Which places it almost certainly somewhere in South East Asia.

In Bali I think this form of the tumpal motif is referred to as "patera mas-masan".

This motif is one of a group of motifs that existed in the Dongson culture and descended into the Malay Peninsula and the Indonesian Archipelago from Northern Vietnam.

It can be found in a wide variety of applications, from pre-historic bronze drums , to Hindu-Buddhist architecture, to batik fabrics, and of course we can find it in keris hilts.

The other motifs in this group that are most frequently encountered are hooks, single spirals, interlocking spirals, and stylised anthropomorphic figures that are connected with ancestor worship.

In its Indonesian incarnation this triangular motif has a number of interpretations, and dependent upon where and how it has been used it might be interpreted as Mt. Meru, The Tree of Life, a symbol of plenty, a protective device to deflect negative influences, amongst other interpretations.

So --- the other places that we've seen it are in S.E.Asian art, and especially Indonesian art.

Would anybody care to look closely at the execution of the carving and and the way in which this tumpal motif has been rendered?

Perhaps these things may provide a clue.

This hilt is 124mm. (a little under 5inches) long.

drdavid · 4th December 2010, 05:33 AM

Alan, what is the line around the lower abdomen seen on the front view, is it a belt or just a ridge.
david

A. G. Maisey · 4th December 2010, 05:46 AM

David, that photograph is deceptive.

It looks like a line, or maybe even like a kangaroo pouch, or the top of a sarung, but it is none of these things. Its just the protruding lower abdomen and the way the light strikes it.

Jean · 4th December 2010, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Would anybody care to look closely at the execution of the carving and and the way in which this tumpal motif has been rendered?

Perhaps these things may provide a clue.

This hilt is 124mm. (a little under 5inches) long.

Hello Alan,
OK , the hilt is bigger that I expected so it is actually a kris hilt.
According to the unpublished book from the late Bambang Harsrinuskmo "Ukiran dan hulu keris", he shows some rather similar hilts which he calls as primitive style and he attributes them to West Nusa Tenggara (Lombok, Sumbawa, and Sumba) or "Bali or surroundings". He also shows one similar piece but with a carved selut which he says was used by Balinese priests. However we know that Pak Bambang was not a very reliable source of information outside Java.... Sorry I cannot add pictures as I only have a poor quality photocopy of the book.
Personally besides the single tumpal motif I don't see much Hindu influence in this type of hilt.
Best regards
Jean

A. G. Maisey · 4th December 2010, 12:26 PM

Jean, I cannot see anything Hindu at all in this hilt. The tumpal motif goes back a lot further than the Hindu influences in Maritime S.E, Asia.

I really do not know where this hilt is from, so I'm just looking at it the same as everybody else. However, I do have a couple of small advantages:- I've got the thing in my hand, and although I've forgotten what sort of keris it came off, I do know that at the time I got it, I was buying mostly Bali & Lombok keris.

It is too big for a Jawa keris, and that makes it too big for almost any other keris, except Bali & Lombok.

It lacks the refined quality of even a village standard Bali hilt & the overall feeling of the carving is very much like a lot of the stuff that we see coming out of Lombok.

I am very much inclined towards a Lombok origin for this hilt, but I'm more than ready to listen to any other suggestions, especially if a little bit of supportive evidence could be included.

4th December 2010, 02:29 AM	#1
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	Not just Sumatra, but also in N. Peninsula (see silver coteng pic at the bottom), but the thing is that the form of the motif is not the same. In Sumatra/N Peninsula, the motif is fatter/rounder. Anyway, the hilt Alan posted has a style that does not seem to be from the Sumatra/Malay side of the Archipelago, but more of the rounder, more naturalistic forms I thought is usually found on the western side of the archipelago. Ok, this is my guess, but let's see how far off I am. Attached Images

4th December 2010, 03:45 AM	#2
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,897	Yes, its a representation of the tumpal motif. Which places it almost certainly somewhere in South East Asia. In Bali I think this form of the tumpal motif is referred to as "patera mas-masan". This motif is one of a group of motifs that existed in the Dongson culture and descended into the Malay Peninsula and the Indonesian Archipelago from Northern Vietnam. It can be found in a wide variety of applications, from pre-historic bronze drums , to Hindu-Buddhist architecture, to batik fabrics, and of course we can find it in keris hilts. The other motifs in this group that are most frequently encountered are hooks, single spirals, interlocking spirals, and stylised anthropomorphic figures that are connected with ancestor worship. In its Indonesian incarnation this triangular motif has a number of interpretations, and dependent upon where and how it has been used it might be interpreted as Mt. Meru, The Tree of Life, a symbol of plenty, a protective device to deflect negative influences, amongst other interpretations. So --- the other places that we've seen it are in S.E.Asian art, and especially Indonesian art. Would anybody care to look closely at the execution of the carving and and the way in which this tumpal motif has been rendered? Perhaps these things may provide a clue. This hilt is 124mm. (a little under 5inches) long.

4th December 2010, 05:33 AM	#3
drdavid Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Australia Posts: 371	Alan, what is the line around the lower abdomen seen on the front view, is it a belt or just a ridge. david

4th December 2010, 05:46 AM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,897	David, that photograph is deceptive. It looks like a line, or maybe even like a kangaroo pouch, or the top of a sarung, but it is none of these things. Its just the protruding lower abdomen and the way the light strikes it.

4th December 2010, 12:26 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,897	Jean, I cannot see anything Hindu at all in this hilt. The tumpal motif goes back a lot further than the Hindu influences in Maritime S.E, Asia. I really do not know where this hilt is from, so I'm just looking at it the same as everybody else. However, I do have a couple of small advantages:- I've got the thing in my hand, and although I've forgotten what sort of keris it came off, I do know that at the time I got it, I was buying mostly Bali & Lombok keris. It is too big for a Jawa keris, and that makes it too big for almost any other keris, except Bali & Lombok. It lacks the refined quality of even a village standard Bali hilt & the overall feeling of the carving is very much like a lot of the stuff that we see coming out of Lombok. I am very much inclined towards a Lombok origin for this hilt, but I'm more than ready to listen to any other suggestions, especially if a little bit of supportive evidence could be included.