Solomon, Hawaiian or????

[Gavin Nugent]

Thank you for the most informative post Vandoo.
When I first saw this available, my initial reactions were New Guinea but only in so far as designs I am familiar with on many large shields from the mid 20th century. Once in hand and only then did Solomons ring true with me, the desgin element however still has me pondering. The design is by full inspection as old to me as the club itself and despite the 'simple' design it has been done by expert hands in my eyes as each and every stroke that has cut in to the timber has been done with one consistant fluid motion as there is no clear evidence of stop start stop start to the lower surfaces....I guess carving is like splitting timber, easier to do when it is fresh and green.
Another pointer I thought is the timber type and colour too, a type ususally seen in these regions, not a big clue, just a pointer.
I always enjoy a good mystery.

Gav

[VANDOO]

I LOOKED THRU A FEW MORE REFRENCES BUT I AM STILL FLOUNDERING ABOUT. IN THE TWO BOOK SET "OCEANIC ART" BY ANTHONY J.P. MEYER I FOUND. VOLUME 1 PAGE 129, BOTI LONG WAR CLUBS FROM THE EASTERN PAPUAN GULF.

VOLUME 2 PAGE 354, NEW IRELAND MALAGAN IMAGES
NONE REALLY FIT BUT WERE AS CLOSE AS I FOUND IN THOSE BOOKS.

THE EYE SHAPE IS FOUND IN TIKIS IN SEVERAL ISLANDS, TAHITI, BISMARK ARCHEPELIGO ISLANDS AND NEW ZEALAND. THE ROUND EYE AND EYE SLIT SHAPES ARE ALSO FOUND IN THOSE AREAS. I SUSPECT THE EYE SHAPE AS WELL AS THE MOUTH INDICATES IF THE FIGURE IS ANGRY OR PEACFUL, GOOD OR BAD.

THE PROTRUDING TONGUE IS FOUND MOSTLY IN AREAS SETTLED BY THE MAORI AND I SUSPECT THAT TRIBES DESENDENTS SPREAD INTO OTHER AREAS AS WELL AS NEW ZEALAND. SHARP POINTY TEETH ARE NOT A FEATURE OF THEIR CARVING DESIGNS AND THE SUN BURST PATTERN AROUND THE EYES ON YOUR CLUB DOSEN'T FIT WELL WITH OCEANIC DESIGN. PERHAPS THE CARVER WAS IN A HURRY AND DIDN'T CARE ABOUT TRADITIONAL DESIGNS. THE CARVING COULD PROBABLY HAVE BEEN DONE QUICKLY AND EASILY WITH A SMALL KNIFE.
TWO MAORI PICTURES , ONE TATOO AND ONE MASK
ONE NEW IRELAND ANCESTOR FIGURE WITH BIRD HANGING ON LIP
ONE MARQUESAN STYLE TIKI

[Gavin Nugent]

Nice array of images Vandoo.

I think the new Ireland image is closest thus far in design but the Solomons club previously is closest by design....very ponderous indeed considering how close the regions really are to each other.....

Gav

[fearn]

Another thing I'd point out is nose shape: Melanesians tend to have long, arrow-like noses, and they tend to emphasize nose shape in their art. This is not a hard-and-fast rule, but it seems to hold true for their art, at least as far as I know.

Gav's club has a rounder nose, perhaps more Polynesian or Asian. But as Vandoo noted, those sunburst/eyelashed eyes aren't oceanic in a traditional sense, nor is the spear coming at the mouth. As for the spear going into the mouth? That's just odd.

I'm afraid I'm still thinking more modern on this one.

Best,

F

[Gavin Nugent]

The Mystery continues Fearn, modern comes with many different ideas too.
WWII is by my standards considered modern history, the period I feel this comes from. Modern by others standard differ greatly I am sure.

Casting out a total speculation theory, which is half the fun of this unknown stuff, with regards to the design, if indeed from the Solomon regions, the Japanese and allied forces were ever present and painting and design elements such at this were seen on allied aircraft and no doubt other vehicles etc etc.
Perhaps this is an influence from being exposed to these things...perhaps seeing a gun at work for the first time and not knowning that they do not shoot arrows, this was carved with intent to protect from the lightning fast arrows these weapons shot....just thinking outside of the square...

Fearn, where do you think this is from and where do you think it dates?

Gav

[fearn]

If I had to guess, I'd say post-WWII Hawaii or similar western place. To me, the face looks like a sketch from someone who had some western art training. The club looks like it was made from a plank. I'd also say that the butt end is not well designed, in that it forces the user to hold the club near an anti-node. If the blade is hit, I would guess that the handle would vibrate quite a bit.

As for the wear marks, it could indeed have been used, but that use could equally have come from someone goofing around. I've got some things that now look like they went through a war. They didn't--I was just a dumb teenager seeing what I could cut and/or bash.

That's my opinion, I'm afraid. In this case, I'm hoping that the evidence says I'm wrong.

Best,

F

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by fearn

If I had to guess, I'd say post-WWII Hawaii or similar western place. To me, the face looks like a sketch from someone who had some western art training. The club looks like it was made from a plank. I'd also say that the butt end is not well designed, in that it forces the user to hold the club near an anti-node. If the blade is hit, I would guess that the handle would vibrate quite a bit.

As for the wear marks, it could indeed have been used, but that use could equally have come from someone goofing around. I've got some things that now look like they went through a war. They didn't--I was just a dumb teenager seeing what I could cut and/or bash.

That's my opinion, I'm afraid. In this case, I'm hoping that the evidence says I'm wrong.

Best,

F

Thanks Fearn. I'll get some more data on the piece for you and draw some comparative data from the other clubs I have here too.
To question further though, post WWII is some 65 years, care to provide a little more accuracy to the comment?
Indeed the art in my eye could be revival school at face value...more reading and looking to do.
However when comparing this to other images above in loose design I am not so sure.
Vandoo the black and white Bismark plate above, do you know when they date from? I ask as when drawing paralells these too could be considered post WWII....still pondering...I am sure a reader out there knows more detail...feel free to write ;-)

Gav

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by fearn

If I had to guess, I'd say post-WWII Hawaii or similar western place. To me, the face looks like a sketch from someone who had some western art training. The club looks like it was made from a plank. I'd also say that the butt end is not well designed, in that it forces the user to hold the club near an anti-node. If the blade is hit, I would guess that the handle would vibrate quite a bit.

Best,

F

Hi Fearn,

Where many are afraid to test pieces of their collections thinking ill will happen to them, I don't mind giving them a go in controlled circumstances, after all they are not made of glass and almost every piece was made to withstand the rigours of combat.
So I wrapped the head in a light handtowel and rubber bands this afternoon and gave it a few good whacks on the ole kick bag handing in the garage...I can hear the whinces in the crowd.

Feedback;
Single handed use on the cutting edge, no vibration at all and ain't nothing getting up if that hit you.
Single handed use on the flat side, ever so slight vibration...I mean tiny.
Double handed use, a fearsome well controlled weapon....

I gave these applications a go with meaning and to put it in perspective I am probably the size of most men from the regions.
A wood on wood contact in the flow of combat would differ little I feel but not to the extent of feeling any vibration through the cutting edge...

Gav