Comments on the blade of this Moro Kris?

Bill · 5th June 2005, 01:38 PM

Michael, Could you post pics of the old kris?

VVV · 5th June 2005, 03:14 PM

Bill,

I am not sure at all if my keris really is old or treated somehow to make it look old. But it doesn't look like a regular keris buda.
I will take some pics of it and let you judge.

Bill · 5th June 2005, 05:16 PM

Thanks for posting all the pics. I'm sure your post of the keris will get responce. I wonder if the same manner was used on both the kris & keris, only less on the kris. I guess this is a dangerous subject, too much info may cause some old pieces to get this type of etch. Does anyone have an idea how long this type of etch has been done? I guess an old heirloom piece may have been ecthed some time after its originations, only to enhance it, where if done today, it would be done to enhance value, & in my opinion destroying the piece. Rick, can you post close-ups of the etching on your pieces, do you think they were done by the same process as in Michaels kris? Antiques post a pic from Houlstein, in this old tread http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001982.html , of an unusual piece, if I re-call, it had a deep etch, & Bugis like hilt.

Rick · 5th June 2005, 05:48 PM

Bill , none of my Moro pieces were done in the style of Michael's . They , for the most part , show only a surface pattern . The only example of a Moro sword that has some slight topography that I have is the one posted further back in this thread ; there is a picture of the tip showing the edge applied around the twisted core .

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As for the keris on the other thread ; it looks like it was buried , or was made to look so . That is not a finish that comes from centuries of ritual etching IMO .

tom hyle · 6th June 2005, 10:28 AM

Too much information (?!) would only likely encourage old Moro swords to get the kind of finish they would've originally had before years of existence; it is too little information that might promote an incorrect/nontraditional treatment; a little knowlege is a dangerous thing.

nechesh · 8th June 2005, 01:38 AM

I've been watching this thread progress from the start, but only now have something to add. firstly let me say that personally i think this is a stunning kris which you are indeed fortunate to possess. As to the questions raised, this looks to me to be a true pamor. I was looking through my copy of Keris and Other Malay Weapons (the MBRAS collection, not Gardner's work) and found a strikingly similar kris in Wooley's article,The Malay Keris: It's Origins and Development on page 123. Now granted, this is merely a pen and ink drawing, but i think it is clearly the same type of arrangement. Since this article was copy written in 1947 that would imply that keris given this type of treatment have been around for at least more than half a century.

5th June 2005, 01:38 PM	#1
Bill Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chicago area Posts: 327	Michael, Could you post pics of the old kris?

5th June 2005, 03:14 PM	#2
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Bill, I am not sure at all if my keris really is old or treated somehow to make it look old. But it doesn't look like a regular keris buda. I will take some pics of it and let you judge.

5th June 2005, 05:16 PM	#3
Bill Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chicago area Posts: 327	Thanks for posting all the pics. I'm sure your post of the keris will get responce. I wonder if the same manner was used on both the kris & keris, only less on the kris. I guess this is a dangerous subject, too much info may cause some old pieces to get this type of etch. Does anyone have an idea how long this type of etch has been done? I guess an old heirloom piece may have been ecthed some time after its originations, only to enhance it, where if done today, it would be done to enhance value, & in my opinion destroying the piece. Rick, can you post close-ups of the etching on your pieces, do you think they were done by the same process as in Michaels kris? Antiques post a pic from Houlstein, in this old tread http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001982.html , of an unusual piece, if I re-call, it had a deep etch, & Bugis like hilt.

5th June 2005, 05:48 PM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	Bill , none of my Moro pieces were done in the style of Michael's . They , for the most part , show only a surface pattern . The only example of a Moro sword that has some slight topography that I have is the one posted further back in this thread ; there is a picture of the tip showing the edge applied around the twisted core . ---------------------------------------------------------------------- As for the keris on the other thread ; it looks like it was buried , or was made to look so . That is not a finish that comes from centuries of ritual etching IMO .

6th June 2005, 10:28 AM	#5
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	Too much information (?!) would only likely encourage old Moro swords to get the kind of finish they would've originally had before years of existence; it is too little information that might promote an incorrect/nontraditional treatment; a little knowlege is a dangerous thing.

8th June 2005, 01:38 AM	#6
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	I've been watching this thread progress from the start, but only now have something to add. firstly let me say that personally i think this is a stunning kris which you are indeed fortunate to possess. As to the questions raised, this looks to me to be a true pamor. I was looking through my copy of Keris and Other Malay Weapons (the MBRAS collection, not Gardner's work) and found a strikingly similar kris in Wooley's article,The Malay Keris: It's Origins and Development on page 123. Now granted, this is merely a pen and ink drawing, but i think it is clearly the same type of arrangement. Since this article was copy written in 1947 that would imply that keris given this type of treatment have been around for at least more than half a century.