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#1 |
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Hello,
I bring to light a topic which was probably never discussed before. Ive been seeing alot of these swords lately, yet I wasnt sure. Some people claim they are made in Yemen, others in India. Can anyone enlighten me on this subject. Oriental Arms Sword Oriental Arms Sword 2 Here, Artzi says that they're made in southern Arabia, namely Yemen. Last edited by Rick; 26th June 2005 at 04:54 PM. |
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#2 |
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Notice that the e-bay man writes Hyderabad N India - that is in Sind, it is not the Hyderabad in Deccan.
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#3 | |
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elgood discusses this in his book on arabian arms, with a reference to the indian link. |
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#4 |
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Very well put Brian, and very true as it was.
We mostly tend to forget that trade had been going on for hundreds of years, people had settled in many different places, other than from wher they originally came, and brougt their culture an their habit of living with them. |
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#5 |
Arms Historian
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I agree with Brian, that it is difficult to assign either Indian or Arabian origins to this distinct form of sword as it is in effect both. As Jens has noted, the key to most diffusion of culture, in which we focus primarily on weapons, has been carried via trade.
As has also been noted, these swords are described in Elgood ("The Arms and Armour of Arabia") as 'Hadhrami', essentially from Hadhramaut in southern Arabia, as part of the Yemen. In this reference, Elgood illustrates three sabres of this distinct hilt form (2.9, 2.10 and 2.11, p.13-14) and in the text discusses the Hadhrami as frequently serving as mercenaries in Hyderabad. Here he notes that "..the swords are certainly made there and locally" (p.15), with one of the swords illustrated noting that the scabbard is likely locally made. There are a number of other key elements which connect the various Arabian swords from this region to probable Indian manufacture, as described further in Elgood. These Arabian swords have the distinct nimcha type nock at the base of the grip, but the curious hilt form begs more explanation. The obliquely canted pommel seems to recall another familiar hilt form, and if I may dare to use 'free association' ![]() With the heavy Arab trade that extended from Malabar and into Ceylon with extensions into Malaysian and Indonesian regions as well, it seems quite plausible that such exotica might have returned to Arabia via India, especially as the prevalence of Indian made swords has been established. As always, stylized motif and form tends to degenerate as it becomes more removed from its origin, whether by time, distance, or both. For another interesting comparison, in the Elgood illustrations of the Hadhrami sabres in 2.9 and 2.10, look at the chowk on the crossguards and note the crosslike geometric floral device at the center, then look at the Tatar sabre on the thread with that title posted by Perkun...the crosslike floral device is strikingly similar on the 17th century Tatar sabre. Another very interesting possibility in cultural diffusion!. Best regards, Jim |
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#6 | |
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#7 |
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Kirill,
Excellent!!! What a beauty! Yes thats pretty much the same type 'cross' effect I was referring to. It is interesting to see how widespread was the Persian influence on so many cultural spheres' weapons. While discussing the connection between Mughal India and Arabia with the commerce in weapons, it is important to note that there were profound trade connections between India and trade centers in the Caucusus as well, via Central Asia. Thanks very much for posting this. All the best, Jim |
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#8 |
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Kirill,
Is it really old or a modern manufacture? If the former, I am acutely jealous.... |
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