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#1 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,200
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I have heard that the rencong hilts that ends in an "L" shape is for ceremonial purposes and the others are for battle. Is there any truth to this?
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#2 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Virginia
Posts: 520
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I have never seen anything on the hulu meuccange ( meucagge) being ceremonial. In fact in a recent correspondance with Barbara Leigh she said that rentcong were often used for assassinations but she did not know of Siwiah being used for them. There are certainly many of them are look functional and are not ornate, perhaps Utami or Albert can offer more.
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#3 |
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
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I have also a question about rencongs!
Where these rencongs made of elephant fossile molar hilts made for use or just for touristic perposes? |
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#4 | |
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Singapore
Posts: 1,248
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#5 |
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: USA Georgia
Posts: 1,599
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I have heard that while a few good Indonesian pieces (keris, as well) are made with fossil elephant molar for a wrongko, it is not a preferred material in Indonesia because it so easily damages the blade during removal and re-sheathing.
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#6 | |
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Singapore
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![]() Quote:
![]() For rencong, I've yet to see real authentic old pieces, with fossil elephant molar. ![]() |
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#7 | |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Virginia
Posts: 520
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That hilt and scabbard style do not say rentcong to me. Does it look more like a tumbuk lada or siwaih to anyone else except me ? I also think ivory is more common on them (though I am not familiar with fossil ivory being used). The blade does have more of the shape of a rentcong. As Alam Shah pointed out the base of the blade ( tampo ? )is round not hexagonal. Hexagonal would point more towards my tumbuk lada feeling. But I think tumbak lada are also found with round bases Here is the heagonal base on a tumbuk lada blade for reference to what we are talking about ![]() ![]() The round base on a siwaih ![]() If I had to make a pick on Javagolok's piece I would have called it a siwaih. Last edited by RhysMichael; 7th August 2007 at 02:08 AM. |
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#8 | ||
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
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how about sewars? Quote:
I looked in the book of Zonneveld about your opinion and indeed when I look at the pics and Text, I also think it comes the most near the Siwaih. |
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#9 |
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: The Netherlands
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Looks like we are wandering of from the question.
![]() Ceremonial use ? Look at the picture. Take a good rencong with L shaped hilt. put it in your belt the way the Acehnese wear them. Draw the rencong from the sheath. It is one of the best close combat weapons I can imagine. Apart from the fact that I will ofcourse prefer to stay out of any combat ![]() |
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#10 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,252
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Hello Battara,
I'm with Willem on this. However, I have to note that hulu puntung and hulu dandan are also very nice to hold/use. Despite their neverending variations, traditional hilts on SE Asian blades seem to be primarily designed for ergonomic function and only secondarily for display purposes... Quote:
If I recall correctly, the Dutch outlawed rencong and many hulu meuccange got shortened into hulu puntung to make it more easily concealable. Still need to verify this story though... Regards, Kai |
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#11 |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
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Hello Maurice,
I believe your blade is pretty recent; I'm not sure it was produced on Sumatra either. I haven't seen any antique northern Sumatran blade with fossil elephant molar fittings - I'd guess those folks were just too much concerned about durability and other practical issues... ![]() Regards, Kai |
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#12 |
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: The Netherlands
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Small addition.
KNIL soldiers where also using the rencong as an additional weapon. So the rencongs that were taken from the locals were distributed amongst the KNIL soldiers as a personal close combat weapon. I once had a rencong where the L shaped hilt was simply sawn of and the scabbard was marked with a 'V' not something a Acehnese warrior would do. |
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#13 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,200
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Thank you all...
Another question then, what about pamor blades on these - older or not make a difference? |
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#14 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,252
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Hello Jose,
Quote:
Regards, Kai |
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#15 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 951
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The pamor blade s that are not polished are mosty new ones .
Ben |
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#16 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,200
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W
![]() I did not know these things - thank you all very much. ![]() |
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#17 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,252
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![]() Quote:
I assume you mean blades strongly etched and stained with warangan? Also the pamor looks off in those modern repros... Even worse are those heavily etched blades with raised writing (protected by wax) on them! Often their blade shape is also not traditional. Regards, Kai |
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#18 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,200
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Yes, I consider those with the wax resist and writing modern if not made for the market.
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