Gold Cross on top of Pesi

Sajen · 1st November 2009, 01:10 AM

When I understand it correct with my unperfect and little knowlegde in bahasa Indonesia is the meaning that this cross, sometimes inlaid with gold or silver is for high status and respect people. But I am sure that Alan or someone from Indonesia/Malaysia/Singapore can translate it better than I am. BTW, I have seen this cross also already by good blades.

sajen

Moshah · 1st November 2009, 03:44 AM

Detlef was really close, as the exact translation would be "Pesi tapak jalak, where at the surface of the edge of the pesi was given a mark just like a plus (+) sign and filled up with gold or silver, by some societies this doing was associated with enticing some certain luck."

I hope it conveys the right meaning.

BTW, this doing must be of some kind of special cases, if not who would bother to do such thing?

A. G. Maisey · 1st November 2009, 08:17 AM

Moshah's translation is near enough, but in English, we would write the idea conveyed like this:-

Pesi tapak jalak, on the surface of the tip there are two crossed lines, like a plus (+) sign, which are filled with gold or silver; by a part of the community this is considered to have a certain talismanic value.

Moshah · 1st November 2009, 08:41 AM

That would be the right one.

Alan, what kind of talismanic value that normally associated to this kind of kinatah? Was it ever called kinatah, anyway?

I doubt that it was created to deter status, as nobody will walk around flaunt the pesi or wearing a keris without the ukiran / hilt...unless if there are secret society / occult meeting which needs you to reveal certain part of the keris.

Hmm, I might be seeing much cult movies lately

Gustav · 1st November 2009, 10:18 AM

Not status, a talismanic value. Nobody bears his talisman visible for all people.

A. G. Maisey · 1st November 2009, 12:06 PM

I'd like to stay out of this discussion.

I'm interested in seeing what opinions might arise.

Gustav · 1st November 2009, 12:31 PM

We most probably are not able to have a discussion about this. The meaning of this pesi must be clear for Alan and some members who post very seldom.

And of course for Haryo Haryoguritno. I think, the information in his book about this kind of pesi is well dosed for a broad public, for most of us.

1st November 2009, 01:10 AM	#1
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,394	When I understand it correct with my unperfect and little knowlegde in bahasa Indonesia is the meaning that this cross, sometimes inlaid with gold or silver is for high status and respect people. But I am sure that Alan or someone from Indonesia/Malaysia/Singapore can translate it better than I am. BTW, I have seen this cross also already by good blades. sajen Last edited by Sajen; 1st November 2009 at 01:37 AM.

1st November 2009, 03:44 AM	#2
Moshah Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 171	Detlef was really close, as the exact translation would be "Pesi tapak jalak, where at the surface of the edge of the pesi was given a mark just like a plus (+) sign and filled up with gold or silver, by some societies this doing was associated with enticing some certain luck." I hope it conveys the right meaning. BTW, this doing must be of some kind of special cases, if not who would bother to do such thing?

1st November 2009, 08:17 AM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,070	Moshah's translation is near enough, but in English, we would write the idea conveyed like this:- Pesi tapak jalak, on the surface of the tip there are two crossed lines, like a plus (+) sign, which are filled with gold or silver; by a part of the community this is considered to have a certain talismanic value.

1st November 2009, 08:41 AM	#4
Moshah Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 171	That would be the right one. Alan, what kind of talismanic value that normally associated to this kind of kinatah? Was it ever called kinatah, anyway? I doubt that it was created to deter status, as nobody will walk around flaunt the pesi or wearing a keris without the ukiran / hilt...unless if there are secret society / occult meeting which needs you to reveal certain part of the keris. Hmm, I might be seeing much cult movies lately

1st November 2009, 10:18 AM	#5
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,295	Not status, a talismanic value. Nobody bears his talisman visible for all people.

1st November 2009, 12:06 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,070	I'd like to stay out of this discussion. I'm interested in seeing what opinions might arise.

1st November 2009, 12:31 PM	#7
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,295	We most probably are not able to have a discussion about this. The meaning of this pesi must be clear for Alan and some members who post very seldom. And of course for Haryo Haryoguritno. I think, the information in his book about this kind of pesi is well dosed for a broad public, for most of us.