Sumbawa keris for enjoy and discussion

Sajen · 23rd August 2009, 03:06 PM

More pics. Sorry, the pictures not anymore in right order.

Battara · 23rd August 2009, 06:02 PM

How old is this keris? Looks like it is for court wear.

Gustav · 23rd August 2009, 06:44 PM

It is something, that really interests me.

In last time there are many Sumbawa kerisses with such silvery samplengs, from Sumbawa and Lombok.
Most of them also have toli-toli. I don't believe, they all are old.

Is there a possibility to recognize the older ones? Is this sampleng old (it looks to me older)? Is the toli-toli old? It seems to be slightly different to this sampleng.

A nice wood grain!

A very interesting blade, I have never seen such out-of-bugis-influence Sumbawa blade before. How long is it?

Sajen · 23rd August 2009, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gustav

It is something, that really interests me.

In last time there are many Sumbawa kerisses with such silvery samplengs, from Sumbawa and Lombok.
Most of them also have toli-toli. I don't believe, they all are old.

Is there a possibility to recognize the older ones? Is this sampleng old (it looks to me older)? Is the toli-toli old? It seems to be slightly different to this sampleng.

A nice wood grain!

A very interesting blade, I have never seen such out-of-bugis-influence Sumbawa blade before. How long is it?

Hi Gustav,

have to agree with you, I also don't think that they all old while the construction most of the time is very good and fine.
When I look to my keris I am sure that it's an old one and that the sheat is worked for this blade. I get the handle to the same time and added it to the keris because I think that it fits very good (also silver, same stones, I think ruby). The white stones are inten, they cratch glass.
The blade is maybe a traded blade from Java, maybe Mr. Maisey can confirm this. The blade is 34 cm long without pesi.

sajen

Gustav · 23rd August 2009, 07:56 PM

Hello Sajen,

I like the luk of this blade very much, they are really graceful (to me).

This hilt is a little bit "to much" for me, I think, such a hilt would match a warangka, which also repoussed with silver (but the tastes are different).

Were it possible to see a picture of the original hilt?

Sajen · 23rd August 2009, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gustav

Hello Sajen,

I like the luk of this blade very much, they are really graceful (to me).

Thank you Gustav, I also like the blade from shape and pamor.
Here a picture with remote toli toli.

sajen

Rick · 23rd August 2009, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajen

The blade is maybe a traded blade from Java, maybe Mr. Maisey can confirm this. The blade is 34 cm long without pesi.

sajen

I was wondering about that Sajen .

A. G. Maisey · 23rd August 2009, 11:47 PM

From what I can see in the photos this blade does look like Jawa.

Having said that I will now say this:-

I have not studied keris from Sumbawa in depth.

I know what people living in Jawa and Bali regard as Sumbawa keris; I have seen photos of Sumbawa keris in a couple of books; I have a first edition of Stone, in which the illustrations are vastly better than in the later editions, and there are several keris attributed to Sumbawa shown in this book.

Based upon my extremely limited knowledge I cannot see any resemblance between this keris, and what I understand to be a Sumbawa keris.

I do know this:- certain dealers in Surabaya and Jogja assemble rare, unusual, and highly desireable keris from a mixture of genuine old parts and newly manufactured parts that have been carefully aged. These creations are then often marketed as having come from an area of the Archipelago that is not well known, and about which almost nothing exists to assist in verification of originality of keris.

In the case of a keris such as this one, I would want certification of provenance before I would accept that it is a real Sumbawa keris. Some of that work in the dress looks decidedly Jawa to me.

Amuk Murugul · 24th August 2009, 04:20 AM

Hullo everybody,

The hilt on this piece reminds me of a shop in Gianyar which sells similarly-constructed hilts which are sold as Bugis.

Best,

Sajen · 23rd August 2009, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

How old is this keris? Looks like it is for court wear.

Hello Battara,

I don't know exacly the age of this keris. The hilt I added later, original the keris have had a nice wooden hilt with pendokok from silver. So maybe the hilt isn't old like all other. I think that the sheat is original to the blade. The wooden warangka with the top from black horn have a nice old patina. The blade is maybe a traded Java blade.

sajen

23rd August 2009, 03:06 PM	#1
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,164	More pics. Sorry, the pictures not anymore in right order. Attached Images

23rd August 2009, 06:02 PM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	How old is this keris? Looks like it is for court wear.

23rd August 2009, 06:44 PM	#3
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,273	It is something, that really interests me. In last time there are many Sumbawa kerisses with such silvery samplengs, from Sumbawa and Lombok. Most of them also have toli-toli. I don't believe, they all are old. Is there a possibility to recognize the older ones? Is this sampleng old (it looks to me older)? Is the toli-toli old? It seems to be slightly different to this sampleng. A nice wood grain! A very interesting blade, I have never seen such out-of-bugis-influence Sumbawa blade before. How long is it?

23rd August 2009, 07:56 PM	#5
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,273	Hello Sajen, I like the luk of this blade very much, they are really graceful (to me). This hilt is a little bit "to much" for me, I think, such a hilt would match a warangka, which also repoussed with silver (but the tastes are different). Were it possible to see a picture of the original hilt?

23rd August 2009, 11:47 PM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,989	From what I can see in the photos this blade does look like Jawa. Having said that I will now say this:- I have not studied keris from Sumbawa in depth. I know what people living in Jawa and Bali regard as Sumbawa keris; I have seen photos of Sumbawa keris in a couple of books; I have a first edition of Stone, in which the illustrations are vastly better than in the later editions, and there are several keris attributed to Sumbawa shown in this book. Based upon my extremely limited knowledge I cannot see any resemblance between this keris, and what I understand to be a Sumbawa keris. I do know this:- certain dealers in Surabaya and Jogja assemble rare, unusual, and highly desireable keris from a mixture of genuine old parts and newly manufactured parts that have been carefully aged. These creations are then often marketed as having come from an area of the Archipelago that is not well known, and about which almost nothing exists to assist in verification of originality of keris. In the case of a keris such as this one, I would want certification of provenance before I would accept that it is a real Sumbawa keris. Some of that work in the dress looks decidedly Jawa to me.

24th August 2009, 04:20 AM	#9
Amuk Murugul Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Kaboejoetan Galoenggoeng Mélben Posts: 472	Hullo everybody, The hilt on this piece reminds me of a shop in Gianyar which sells similarly-constructed hilts which are sold as Bugis. Best,