BANGKINANG & BAHARI kerises? - Page 2

Amuk Murugul · 2nd July 2008, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rahman

...

I hesitate on this comment by Amuk though. The Sultan of Malacca retreated to Johor after the Portugese invasion of 1511 and set up a sultanate that lasted until 1699 in the Johor Lama/Kota Tinggi area. I have no info on Datuk Bahaman....

I know very little about peninsular history so please, DO correct me if I'm wrong. My understanding is:
In 1511 the sultan of Malaka fled to dependencies: Siak, Rokan, Indragiri, Kampar/Bangkinang, Riaoe and finally to Djohor.
When the Portuguese destroyed his base in Bintan in 1526, the sultan then retreated to Kampar/Bangkinang in Soematera where he became ruler of Pekantoea Kampar until he passed away in 1528 (He was buried in Pekantoea Kampar). He left behind two sons named Moezafar Sjah and Alaoedin Sjah II
Moezafar Sjah established the Sultanate of Perak, while Alaoeddin founded the Sultanate of Djohor, the successor of Malaka.

Best.

ganjawulung · 26th June 2009, 05:16 AM

Dear All,

I just want to share pictures with you on my "keris panjang" collection for the last four years. I hope, some of them are keris bahari or even anak alang. Aren't they? Just for intermezzo...

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung · 26th June 2009, 05:19 AM

These are more pictures on such kerises...

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung · 26th June 2009, 05:21 AM

These are more close ups

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung · 26th June 2009, 05:25 AM

These are more and more close ups of the hilt and base of keris area...

GANJAWULUNG

ganjawulung · 28th June 2009, 06:14 AM

These are supposed to be Sumatran kerises, or some of them could be Bangkinang kerises. All have "double greneng" at their rear part. Do every keris panjang, bangkinang, bahari, anak alang kerises always have double greneng?

Here are some of variations of the supposed to be Sumatran double greneng...

GANJAWULUNG

Sajen · 28th June 2009, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganjawulung

These are supposed to be Sumatran kerises, or some of them could be Bangkinang kerises. All have "double greneng" at their rear part. Do every keris panjang, bangkinang, bahari, anak alang kerises always have double greneng?

Here are some of variations of the supposed to be Sumatran double greneng...

GANJAWULUNG

Dear Ganjawulung,

all in my collection have also this double greneng.

sajen

ganjawulung · 28th June 2009, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajen

all in my collection have also this double greneng.

sajen

Would you please upload your collection? Especially the keris panjang form, or bahari kerises...

Thanks in advance, Sajen,

GANJAWULUNG

erikscollectables · 28th June 2009, 08:24 PM

Here is another panjang.

It is not mine but I do have it hone at the moment. The owner asked me to sell this one for him but I am tempted to buy it myself.

Expect to get another one that I already did buy last week.
As soon as it is here I will upload a picture.

Regards, Erik

Sajen · 29th June 2009, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganjawulung

Would you please upload your collection? Especially the keris panjang form, or bahari kerises...

Thanks in advance, Sajen,

GANJAWULUNG

Hello Ganjawulung,

your wish is my order!

Here my three panjang. The longest one is 58 cm long (only the blade without peksi) and have pamor, I think this is rare.
The small one is only 36 cm. Sorry that the pictures not the best quality, I take them very fast.
sajen

Sajen · 29th June 2009, 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by erikscollectables

Here is another panjang.

It is not mine but I do have it hone at the moment. The owner asked me to sell this one for him but I am tempted to buy it myself.

Expect to get another one that I already did buy last week.
As soon as it is here I will upload a picture.

Regards, Erik

Hi Erik,
buy it! It's a nice complete example, only the tips of the wrangka are broken.
sajen

ganjawulung · 29th June 2009, 07:44 AM

My Goodness,
... anytime if I want to see good examples of keris panjang, then I must go to Europe. Not to Suimatra anymore.

Thanks Erik, and Sajen for the picture sharing.

GANJAWULUNG

Sajen · 29th June 2009, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganjawulung

My Goodness,
... anytime if I want to see good examples of keris panjang, then I must go to Europe. Not to Suimatra anymore.

Thanks Erik, and Sajen for the picture sharing.

GANJAWULUNG

Dear Pak Ganja,

nothing to thank. And your examples also very nice.

sajen

erikscollectables · 29th June 2009, 08:20 PM

Pak Ganja also many thanks to you for sharing these great examples!
One question my example had a ship made of horn, not wood.
Is this common with the crescent shaped ships?
The ukiran is of wood which I think in most examples is made of horn?

Regards, Erik

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajen

Dear Pak Ganja,

nothing to thank. And your examples also very nice.

sajen

Sajen · 29th June 2009, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by erikscollectables

Pak Ganja also many thanks to you for sharing these great examples!
One question my example had a ship made of horn, not wood.
Is this common with the crescent shaped ships?
The ukiran is of wood which I think in most examples is made of horn?

Regards, Erik

Hello Erik,

no, it isn't found so much that the wrangka is from horn, a second reason to buy it. And yes, the handles most of the time from horn.
My both big examples have handles from horn while the wrangkas from wood.

Regards,

sajen

ganjawulung · 30th June 2009, 04:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by erikscollectables

One question my example had a ship made of horn, not wood.
Is this common with the crescent shaped ships?
The ukiran is of wood which I think in most examples is made of horn?

Ship? Do you mean the upper part of the sheath? IMHO, the common material is wood. But I have some upper-part warangkas which are made of horn, with fine grain. Not Sumatran warangka, but Tegal upper-part of warangkas (without gandars -- pictures below).

My keris panjang's handle is made of (buffalo) horn too...

GANJAWULUNG

VVV · 4th July 2009, 02:35 PM

Interesting,

Here is an anak alang with the ship made of rhino horn and
the simle hilt repaired.

Michael

Sajen · 4th July 2009, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VVV

Interesting,

Here is an anak alang with the ship made of rhino horn and
the simle hilt repaired.

Michael

Very unsual hilt-repair, never seen something like this before.

sajen

BluErf · 5th July 2009, 03:57 AM

I've seen repairs like this done in the peninsula. Yes, I have always found such repairs to result in unusual looks.

A. G. Maisey · 5th July 2009, 06:27 AM

I have not been following this thread, but I've just scanned through it and noticed my name.

Kai, I do not know anything much about this subject, and I do not like to speculate, or really, even to comment unless I can back up what I say, so I have said nothing about the keris form being discussed here.

Yes, I do have quite a few of these keris, they are not all straight, several are waved, they are not all without pamor, the blade styles vary from what is shown here through to distinctly Bugis and Javanese blades. One I have is the state execution keris of Brunei dating from 1842, and it is like a very slim Moro keris. Scabbard styles vary from the typical Peninsula ones shown here to Bugis, Jawa, and unidentified.

I am inclined to think that this long blade style was probably pretty widely spread throughout S.E. Asia.

ganjawulung · 17th March 2010, 03:06 AM

Dear All,
I try to match this old sumatran 'pendokok' to a jawa demam hilt recently. Are they a good match, or not, if I put this composition to a Riau keris like this? I know there are some sumatran experts around here. Would be grateful to hear your comment...

GANJAWULUNG

karset · 17th March 2010, 07:56 AM

1895 aceh. Maharaja syahbandar,,?.
(image belong to KTLV)

semar · 17th March 2010, 11:07 AM

one of my bahari keris for compare

regards semar

ganjawulung · 17th March 2010, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by karset

1895 aceh. Maharaja syahbandar,,?.
(image belong to KTLV)

Thanks a lot Karset,
Good example to notice. Although not clear enough, the hilt doesn't seem to be a tapak kuda type ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by semar

one of my bahari keris for compare
regards semar

Thanks, Semar for the beautiful example.

GANJAWULUNG

26th June 2009, 05:16 AM	#32
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	KERIS Panjang, Keris Bahari and Anak Alang? Dear All, I just want to share pictures with you on my "keris panjang" collection for the last four years. I hope, some of them are keris bahari or even anak alang. Aren't they? Just for intermezzo... GANJAWULUNG Attached Images Last edited by ganjawulung; 26th June 2009 at 10:51 AM.

26th June 2009, 05:19 AM	#33
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	Are they Bangkinang kerises? These are more pictures on such kerises... GANJAWULUNG Attached Images

26th June 2009, 05:21 AM	#34
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	MORE Close ups These are more close ups GANJAWULUNG Attached Images

26th June 2009, 05:25 AM	#35
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	MORE and More Close ups These are more and more close ups of the hilt and base of keris area... GANJAWULUNG Attached Images

28th June 2009, 06:14 AM	#36
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	Double Greneng These are supposed to be Sumatran kerises, or some of them could be Bangkinang kerises. All have "double greneng" at their rear part. Do every keris panjang, bangkinang, bahari, anak alang kerises always have double greneng? Here are some of variations of the supposed to be Sumatran double greneng... GANJAWULUNG Attached Images

28th June 2009, 08:24 PM	#39
erikscollectables Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 318	Another panjang Here is another panjang. It is not mine but I do have it hone at the moment. The owner asked me to sell this one for him but I am tempted to buy it myself. Expect to get another one that I already did buy last week. As soon as it is here I will upload a picture. Regards, Erik Attached Images

29th June 2009, 07:44 AM	#42
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	My Goodness, ... anytime if I want to see good examples of keris panjang, then I must go to Europe. Not to Suimatra anymore. Thanks Erik, and Sajen for the picture sharing. GANJAWULUNG

4th July 2009, 02:35 PM	#47
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Interesting, Here is an anak alang with the ship made of rhino horn and the simle hilt repaired. Michael Attached Images

5th July 2009, 03:57 AM	#49
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	I've seen repairs like this done in the peninsula. Yes, I have always found such repairs to result in unusual looks.

5th July 2009, 06:27 AM	#50
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,893	I have not been following this thread, but I've just scanned through it and noticed my name. Kai, I do not know anything much about this subject, and I do not like to speculate, or really, even to comment unless I can back up what I say, so I have said nothing about the keris form being discussed here. Yes, I do have quite a few of these keris, they are not all straight, several are waved, they are not all without pamor, the blade styles vary from what is shown here through to distinctly Bugis and Javanese blades. One I have is the state execution keris of Brunei dating from 1842, and it is like a very slim Moro keris. Scabbard styles vary from the typical Peninsula ones shown here to Bugis, Jawa, and unidentified. I am inclined to think that this long blade style was probably pretty widely spread throughout S.E. Asia.

17th March 2010, 03:06 AM	#51
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	Good Match or Not? Dear All, I try to match this old sumatran 'pendokok' to a jawa demam hilt recently. Are they a good match, or not, if I put this composition to a Riau keris like this? I know there are some sumatran experts around here. Would be grateful to hear your comment... GANJAWULUNG Attached Images

17th March 2010, 07:56 AM	#52
karset Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 48	once upon the time in Aceh 1895 aceh. Maharaja syahbandar,,?. (image belong to KTLV) Attached Images

17th March 2010, 11:07 AM	#53
semar Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 272	bahari keris one of my bahari keris for compare regards semar Attached Images